Wow! I have just completed my first stage of permanent makeup training and it is FANTASTIC. I was amazed at the amount of colour theory that is involved.

Anyway peeps, I need your help. I am putting together a price list which has an FAQ section, I think I have covered all the questions most people would ask ie does it hurt, is it like a tattoo, can it go wrong, but can you think of any others. What would be your main concern?

Doesn't matter how daft the query, would just like to know your thoughts!

Many thanks

Hi Sarah

The only thing i can think of ...Is there any side effects?
Hope the course goes well fot ya..!

Vicky x

how long does it last? Do certain colours fade quicker than others?

incidentally, is it like a tattoo? Ie., permanent lip liner etc?

Thanks for your speedy replies, and any more thoughts would be really appreciated.

The side effects should be non existent as you go through a VERY thorough consultation including a very detailed medical questionnaire, and you have a skin patch test of the pigments a minimum of 48 hours before the treatment. I had my eyeliner done and it just feels a little itchy at the mo, but I actually think it is from the after care cream I have to use, not the treatment itself!

LCN call it permanent makeup as the pigment will always be in the dermis layer of the skin to a greater or lesser degree, even if it is not visible by the naked eye. How long it will last is very unpredictable and there are no guarantees, a rough guide is 2-5 years on average before a full top us is required, but it could be more or less than this. Darker and older skins hold the pigments better than younger, lighter skins and the darker pigments last better than lighter ones. It also depends on how well you look after it, ie use a total sun block in the sun.

It is a tattoo in that pigments are placed into the skin using fine needles, but it is different from a traditional tattoo as
a) they use indelible inks that are much cheaper, and very blue based, whereas PMC uses refined pigments that are specially developed for the cosmetic industry
b) "trad tattoos" go into the subcutaneous layer of the skin 1-3mm which is much deeper than PMC which only goes into the dermis 0.3 to 0.8mm.

any more questions gratefully received!

I'v got another one..!

I'm allergic to metal could I still have this done? I have Tattoo's are the needles the same?

One of my clients as just had here eyebrows done and i have to say it looks fantastic, She is of to have her lips done next week cant wait to see it as im thinking of having it done.
well done on your course sarha. Have you finished it and if so are you going to be doing it your salon??? might have to have a vist down if you are
caren :-)

Blimey, I really didn't think I'd get any replies at all, so thanks guys.

Vicky your question has me stumped!! I'll have to look into that one, so thanks. I would think if you could have a tattoo then PMC should be fine, but that's one we didn't cover on the course, so I'll check it out tomorrow.


Caren, I have finished stage one on the course which is for the first treatment, stage two is top up procedures in 6 weeks time (you do the top ups of all the models you did the first time round), plus body art. It really is fab isn't it - just like nails, it really enhances what nature didn't quite give you!! I'm hooked, want to have my lips and eyebrows done as well now.

If you'd like to have a treatment pm me, there's 25% off for all Geeks!! It has to be done in my salon as it is regulated by our Local Council, I'm in Fareham which is between POrtsmouth and Southampton.

What happens if i am not happy with the end result or the colours do notturn out how i thought they would?

Will it produce a scab like tattoos? (vile question i know)

Is there any swelling?

One of the good things about LCN is they spend ages going through colour theory, because the pigment won't be the same as when it goes into the skin, the colour of the skin + pigment = final colour. The Colours also may need neutralising ie a warm pigment on a red skin needs neutralising with green, otherwise the result will be a much pinker colour than required. Likewise, lips which are very blue need to be neutralised with a red/orange or your lip liner will be very purple.

You tend to err on the side of caution with colour on the first treatment and go a bit lighter, then if the client likes it and wants to go a bit darker then you can do this on the top up treatment which is 6 weeks later. The colour will also be altered if you get sunburnt, ie your eyebrows may go pink!! So aftercare is mega important! This is why a first class consultation is CRUCIAL!

The lipline and brows are drawn on first, so you know what the end result will be like. The eyeliner is tattoed along the lashline. However, when you first have the treatment the colour is a lot darker than the end result, so don't panic, it can fade by 20 - 50%.

Yes is does scab, but to be honest I can hardly see it on my eyeliner, it just looks like I've gone a bit overboard with the eyeliner pencil lol! But this has nearly all gone 5 days later. The important thing is not to pick the scabs off, tempting though it is, as it pulls the pigment out.

The machine I use is the PMC Kryoliner. This has a machine that you place over the treated area which cools it to about 9 degrees celcius, this dramatically reduces swelling ( and makes the treatment a lot more comfortable - no pain), and on the treatments I did in my training there was very little at all. My eyes did swell up however , but we think this is due to the cataract operations I had as my eyes now react to trauma, my tear ducts were working over time, which made my lids swell. It just looked like I had been crying buckets (that sort of swelling), but it had gone down in 24 hours.

We have a lady who comes down from London and does permanent make up at our salon - some of my clients have it and it does look great. I am having a lip blush done in a couple of weeks, I also want my blusher done as well - that looks fantastic!

Most clients want to know,
if there is any pain involved during and after
aftercare,
what can go wrong and what would happen if anything did go wrong,
who chooses colours and shape/style,
length of procedure,
how frequently it needs topping up,
if you can do the procedure over scar tissue,
I have an allergy (lanolin, gluten, nut, dairy etc..)can I still have procedure?
what happens if client isn't happy/doesnt like result,
most clients want to see some of the therapists before & after pics/portfolio,


Hope that helps a bit, If I think of anything else I will post it later!

Thanks Saffirez, you have to take polaroids of before and after for insurance, but they look dreadful. I'll have to look into getting a digital camera because I think a portfolio would be an excellent idea, again something that hadn't occurred to me, so many thanks. All the other questions I think I have covered.

If you do go wrong - ie off the line, you can flush it through with saline solution and this flushes out the pigment, so there are ways round any "mishaps"! But it is quite difficult to do it as you do it in such a slow motion that provided you have steady hands (which I have, all my clients comment on it) and stretch the skin well it's just a case of drawing along a line you have already drawn on.

Interested in the blusher as LCN don't train this, I'll find out as there's usually a reason why. Could be that the pigment could "migrate" with age and so you have saggy blusher, so to speak!! Just as you shouldn't take the eyeliner further than the lashline as it can migrate outwards and down, so you have a drooping eyeline.

Hi Sarah,

You said that you have to be mega careful as sunburn can affect the colour...how long do you have to be careful, is it just until the top up or the 2-5 years that the treatment lasts or is it forever

Sounds fantastic and I wish I lived closer to Fareham!!!!

Hi Nikki, You have to be careful all the time the pigment is visible to the naked eye. Although of course the politically correct answer is you should never let your skin be overexposed to the sun at all!

Wow. this sounds fantastic! We were toying with the idea of introducing PMC to our salon, but isn't it difficult to get a licence? Don't you need a "skin piercing" licence, same as for ears ? I guess!

And, I am DEFINITELY interested in having my eyes done - blonde hair looks fab on your head but ****e on your eyelashes...

Ooh - just thought, I wear contacts. Obviously can't have them in whilst the treatment is being done, but how long after do you have to wait? If it scabs, and like tattoos if the scab comes off, so do the colour, then you'd have to be seriously careful putting in and taking out your lenses?

Can you PM me with the cost of the eyeliner - oooooer, seriously excited!