Checking out the competition in Shellac

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In that case, they gave you advice that was completely contrary to CND advice which specifically states NOT to soak off Shellac. Must say I am surprised and will forward this thread on to Karen O'Neil so that she is aware of it.
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I could go on to a huge defensive rant here... I wont, there are some very valid and helpful points given and some rather aggressive attacking & personal ones too. I hardly concocted this procedure up now did I ?? It is always best to have been 'trained' in Shellac by a CND professional (I was), should I from now question what a CND Ambassador says regarding their products and how best to use them?

I have been stood corrected as I said twice I could be.... I never said I was right, in fact I simply asked a question....''What exactly is a soak'' and continued to explain what I did. I'd actually like to see the paperwork on that too if it is available as i think it is interesting, is it?

This forum is about learning is it not? I really don't think it is necessary to 're-educate' in such an offensive and/or aggressive manner. I'm a bit disappointed to be honest.

I have been re-educated now however. I've been told as they say!

Cait
 
Thanks so much for bringing this to my attention Gigi... obviously we recommend the wraps to clients, but due to a small hickup with stock we had to advise soaking with double dippers for about 3 minutes until we got the wraps in stock... this was a temporary measure and we did explain that the best and most effective way is use of the wraps.


Luckily we have the wraps now !
 
To be honest, Cait, I think it is common sense and that anyone would know and realise that re-using any solution that someone has soaked in previously is a pretty, shall we say, unattractive thing to do. It is the sort of thing I have observed in NSSalons.

I would immediately question a CND ambassador on such a point and it is easy to find the correct information if you just read the CND Shellac instructions where they are actually very clear in saying ... do NOT soak off Shellac but wrap it off.

CND never ever would promote anything that was unsafe or unhygienic ... unfortunately people are not always as reliable, if indeed it was an Ambassador who taught you that practice, and there is no proof of that and frankly I cannot imagine it .... but if she/he did, then they were teaching their own opinion and certainly not any information from CND. That, is honestly quite obvious.

Thanks Mrs O for commenting and your explanation.
 
Also the Soaking Vs Wrapping, i personally dont think it takes the full 10mins to remove Shellac in wraps! so really do dont need to soak! Everyone should be Wrapppinggg!! Woohoo! or why would CND bother to make them! x
 
Ive thought long and hard and here I am again , its like a scratch I HAVE to itch ! lol!
Look I've of course taken everyones advice and do not now reuse the Acetone - I was told to do this whether there is ''proof of this'' or not is actually irrelevant. Anyway Ill not dwell I just want to have an interesting discussion about this:

OK so wrapping off Shellac - I still think that the skin is exposed longer to Acetone than dipping - The wraps do not only immerse the nail, that is simply not true. Although I do like the idea of rubbing solar oil on the skin to protect it . It takes 10 mins to wrap off (with practice the wrapping takes I dont know - 3?) Anyways the wraps just seem to me a terrible environmental solution. 10 wraps coated in plastic for everyone that comes in - say you average 15 -20 Shellac removals per week thats 150 -200 wraps to dispose of!It just doesnt seem right to me and to be honest since Ive been doing it my customers have also been commenting about the amount of waste.

Dipping - takes 3 mins and you can use more or less the same amount of acetone as you do altogether on the wraps - the waste is less and it just seems to me a more time and environmentally friendly way to do the removal.

Im a gel technician, so I dont know the answer to this. But how do you remove Acrylic from Nails without dipping? Do you also use wraps? How long do you soak for?
What are your thoughts on the above?
thanks
'Cait:Love:
 
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I use Magis wraps. When I wrap off my shellac the underside of my fingertips are not exposed to acetone. If I were to soak off they would be.
 
Ive thought long and hard and here I am again , its like a scratch I HAVE to itch ! lol!
Look Ivetaken everyones advice and do not now reuse the Acetone - I was told to do this whether there is ''proof of this'' or not is actually irrelevant. Anyway Ill not dwell I just want to have an interesting discussion about this:

OK so wrapping off Shellac - I still think that the skin is exposed longer to Acetone than dipping - The wraps do not only immerse the nail, that is simply not true. It takes 10 mins to wrap off (with practice the wrapping takes I dont know - 3?) Anyways the wraps just seem to me a terrible environmental solution. 10 wraps coated in plastic for everyone that comes in - say you average 15 -20 Shellac removals per week thats 150 -200 wraps to dispose!I just doesnt seem right to me and to be honest since Ive been doing it

Dipping - takes 3 mins and you can use more or less the same amount of acetone as you do altogether on the wraps - the waste is less and it just seems to me a more time and environmentally friendly way to do the removal.

Im a gel technician, so I dont know the answer to this. But how do you remove Acrylic from Nails without dipping? Do you also use wraps? How long do you soak for?
What are your thoughts on the above?
thanks
'Cait:Love:

No one would be able to dip there fingers in the small amount of DSperse contained in my CND wraps ... I do not use the foils. I use much less Acetone in a wrap than in a soak.

With l &P I do soak if removing a full set and I wrap if just removing the odd nail during a rebalance. Takes about 15-20 minutes, but The big difference is that I only remove a set of nails infrequently on a person, if at all ... Not every 2-3 weeks as with a soak off colour . The CND wraps absolutely do only target the nail plate and not the whole end of the finger; I never see White dehydrated skin when using them. Also it takes 10 minutes for the remover to work it's way through the tunnels in the Shellac to even get to the plate, and the quick release polymers work so quickly to release the product at that point, that the plate itself has only a minute at most in contact with the acetone.

I do what I think and know is best for my clients. I don't see myself as producing mountains of Shellac wraps that are actually made mostly of a cotton material with a tiny plastic tab. Another reason why I seldom use foils.

I presume you do not or will not ever use disposable diapers/nappies for your babies?
 
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but The big difference is that I only remove a set of nails infrequently on a person, if at all ... Not every 2-3 weeks as with a soak off colour . Yep, I see, this is a good point to remember The CND wraps absolutely do only target the nail plate and not the whole end of the finger; I never see White dehydrated skin when using them. Do you also use the oil with wraps Geeg?Do they not slip off? Will try this today.



I do what I think and know is best for my clients. I don't see myself as producing mountains of Shellac wraps that are actually made mostly of a cotton material with a tiny plastic tab. ok I disagree here, the whole wrap is coated in a plastic but as you say in comparison to nappies!? lol. Another reason why I seldom use foils. Do you mean tin foil here when you say foils?

I presume you do not or will not ever use disposable diapers/nappies for your babies?[/quote]Hah! you are right! good point and I do and I feel really terrible about it ... sigh but I cant bring myself to scrape poo poo off and then boil!

Ok off to think more about this - I am genuinely interested not trying to stoke a fire or anything, but something is niggling at me with this and as with previous posts Ill take this on board. I have been wrapping in general, but my customers have been mentioning the waste issue every time.
Thanks for the input, experience and knowledge again!
Cait x
 
We charge for the removal for shellac because of material's and wraps so yer you should be using them. Doesn't cost much to dip in acetone.
 
I think the only benefit to wrapping vs. dipping is the application of solar oil. Since the wraps target acetone to the nail plate, solar oil can be applied to the surrounding tissue. When dipping, the whole fingertip is exposed to acetone's drying effect.
 
Im a gel technician, so I dont know the answer to this. But how do you remove Acrylic from Nails without dipping? Do you also use wraps? How long do you soak for?

I remove both soakable gel and l+p by wrapping but I use cotton wool and foil rather than any 'wrap' device! I wrap rather than soak mainly because being mobile I really don't want acetone to dispose of when I'm at someone's house - the cotton wool etc go into my little metal bin for me to dispose of later...... When removing l+p I wrap them up individually and start checking after about 20 minutes (having de-bulked first). I then remove and prep each nail one at a time.

Hth's
 
I use Jessica Geleration/CND Shellac but order CND wraps for both as they are brilliant for removing the polish. I use GELeration Erase/D-Solve respectively...I think the wraps are brilliant and what is ten minutes??

Gives you time to talk to your clients and makes them feel special.

I have never reuse acetone on clients.. hygiene is sooo important to me...eeewww.. Nor did i ever think about it...but it is interesting to know what other people have learnt although i feel Cait did not realise it wasnt what we are trained over here. and good for Cait to acknowledge it and asked more questions about it as i feel she really wants to do it the correct way!
 
Hi Cait,
I have to say you are an educators dream student. Asking questions, wanting to be informed, but also asking for the reasons as to why we do what we do and how does it work, why should you do it!!! That is what being a good technician is all about, we learn by asking and then testing it out to see for our selfs.

Soaking is a very old way of removing soak-able coatings, like Shellac. It uses more Acetone, it also means that you are not working time efficiently.
When you soak, you have to remove one finger at a time to scrape of remaining product. Which means you have to keep an eye on the soaking bowl, the clients fingers to make sure they are all still in the acetone. Because if the product drys out before you can remove it, it drys up and you have to re-soak to remove remnant product. Doing all this and remove product from the ready finger is a bit like juggling.....It also leaves a sticky mess around the clients fingers......accidental spillage is also possible, as they are trying to juggle one finger at a time out of the bowl. I find it very faffy and cumbersome.

Using the wrap method means, you work on one finger at a time, it doesn't matter what the client does with the other fingers, they are individually wrapped. Being able to focus on one finger at a time. By the time you have placed all ten wraps on the fingers, it is time to start removing the coating from the first finger, you are spending time removing and not sitting and waiting.
We dispose acetone by soaking it up in couch roll or tissue paper, this then has to evaporate before we can place it in the rubbish bag. Now using wraps means that by the time you have removed all the coating from the fingers, the acetone has evaporated from the wraps and it can be thrown out immediately.

These are just some points that made me stop using the bowl and use wraps.
Client comfort is important to me, they don't feel tied to a bowl and can have a cuppa while I work away. It gives them just a little bit more freedom, while I concentrate on the job at hand so to speak.
Their skin has less acetone exposure, as Gigi, already mentioned, the pads only cover the free edge and the nail plate, so the acetone is targeting the coating and not the whole finger up to the first knuckle. Oil application before applying the wraps is a great way to ensure even less drying of the cuticle area.
Almond soothing cream is also very good, I take a little spatula and place some on a hands down pad, then I use a little soft art brush and apply it around the cuticle area, apply my wraps and they don't slip as the cream is a tad more solid, but it does the trick equally well.
A-H-A Cuticle eraser could also be used instead of the other two, this will make cuticle removal after soaking a breeze, as the cuticle remover sloughs away dead skin cells. It's like shampooing their nails.

Give it all a try and see which method you prefer, wraps with oil, soothing cream or cuticle eraser. Or soaking them in a bowl.....
We learn by listening, but we learn even more by doing, because if it doesn't work we have learned two things..... which one works and which one doesn't work as well.
Let me know how you got on, I love to hear how went xxxxx
 
Hi Cait,
I have to say you are an educators dream student. Asking questions, wanting to be informed, but also asking for the reasons as to why we do what we do and how does it work, why should you do it!!! That is what being a good technician is all about, we learn by asking and then testing it out to see for our selfs.

Soaking is a very old way of removing soak-able coatings, like Shellac. It uses more Acetone, it also means that you are not working time efficiently.
When you soak, you have to remove one finger at a time to scrape of remaining product. Which means you have to keep an eye on the soaking bowl, the clients fingers to make sure they are all still in the acetone. Because if the product drys out before you can remove it, it drys up and you have to re-soak to remove remnant product. Doing all this and remove product from the ready finger is a bit like juggling.....It also leaves a sticky mess around the clients fingers......accidental spillage is also possible, as they are trying to juggle one finger at a time out of the bowl. I find it very faffy and cumbersome.

Using the wrap method means, you work on one finger at a time, it doesn't matter what the client does with the other fingers, they are individually wrapped. Being able to focus on one finger at a time. By the time you have placed all ten wraps on the fingers, it is time to start removing the coating from the first finger, you are spending time removing and not sitting and waiting.
We dispose acetone by soaking it up in couch roll or tissue paper, this then has to evaporate before we can place it in the rubbish bag. Now using wraps means that by the time you have removed all the coating from the fingers, the acetone has evaporated from the wraps and it can be thrown out immediately.

These are just some points that made me stop using the bowl and use wraps.
Client comfort is important to me, they don't feel tied to a bowl and can have a cuppa while I work away. It gives them just a little bit more freedom, while I concentrate on the job at hand so to speak.
Their skin has less acetone exposure, as Gigi, already mentioned, the pads only cover the free edge and the nail plate, so the acetone is targeting the coating and not the whole finger up to the first knuckle. Oil application before applying the wraps is a great way to ensure even less drying of the cuticle area.
Almond soothing cream is also very good, I take a little spatula and place some on a hands down pad, then I use a little soft art brush and apply it around the cuticle area, apply my wraps and they don't slip as the cream is a tad more solid, but it does the trick equally well.
A-H-A Cuticle eraser could also be used instead of the other two, this will make cuticle removal after soaking a breeze, as the cuticle remover sloughs away dead skin cells. It's like shampooing their nails.

Give it all a try and see which method you prefer, wraps with oil, soothing cream or cuticle eraser. Or soaking them in a bowl.....
We learn by listening, but we learn even more by doing, because if it doesn't work we have learned two things..... which one works and which one doesn't work as well.
Let me know how you got on, I love to hear how went xxxxx

Now that was an informative post! Thanks - really good advice Ill be trying this and will let you know how I get on - I like the idea of the Cuticle eraser too perhaps more precise for application. I also agree with Kezza that we charge for removal so therefore the cost should be covered (with the wraps & Acetone & Time) It does sound like the big benefit is that you can protect the surrounding skin with oil/cream instead of exposing the whole finger.

I just wish that perhaps the design of the wraps could then be revisited - take away the plastic coating and have just cotton with as Gigi said 1 tiny plastic tab. That would be something to look into perhaps?

Thank you (Top Tottie) & (Nails in London) for actually 'getting' it /me. I seriously think that necessity is the best form of invention and if we all just follow 1 way without ever questioning or trying new things..well..for example there would be no Shellac in the first place(heaven forbid!) and we would all live under a dictatorship!
I was nervous about reposting this question as the response I received before was very unnerving and rocked my confidence a bit but now Im glad I did.
Thanks y'all!:wink2:
Cait
 

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