Dull gel polish, help!

[NancySyd]

You don't need to be rude to get your point across. If a sales assistant was rude to you to get their point across in a store would you be happy? I would imagine your answer would be no, you can advise people without being rude. I understand you're trying to give the best advice but there are other ways of getting your point across. Rudeness can totally deter someone from asking questions in the future.

I don't know what it is about lamp issues that devolves to this so often.

Electronic communications often strips words of their intent. I don't believe she was being rude; she was being emphatic. And she was being emphatic for a reason - this is a health and safety issue. Not using the proper lamp is a particular problem in our industry. It exposes clients and especially NTs to uncured gel. A lot of NTs will say that they've use any ole lamp and haven't seen any problems. But therein lies the problem. There is no easily accessible way to determine whether a proper cure has been achieved. We rely upon the research and science of the manufacturer to assure us that if we've followed the directions, we will have a proper cure.

BTW, Emma, demeaning the scientists whose work undergirds our work is not a polite or useful strategy. Nor is disrespecting the companies. They have a lot more training and resources at their disposal than any of us do, and do a pretty good job of supporting NTs. I'm all for a healthy skepticism, and have in fact chosen not to use certain products because of their restrictions. But we need to be fostering respect and regard for our peers throughout the industry.

 

[EmmaBxx]

I don't know what it is about lamp issues that devolves to this so often.

Electronic communications often strips words of their intent. I don't believe she was being rude; she was being emphatic. And she was being emphatic for a reason - this is a health and safety issue. Not using the proper lamp is a particular problem in our industry. It exposes clients and especially NTs to uncured gel. A lot of NTs will say that they've use any ole lamp and haven't seen any problems. But therein lies the problem. There is no easily accessible way to determine whether a proper cure has been achieved. We rely upon the research and science of the manufacturer to assure us that if we've followed the directions, we will have a proper cure.

BTW, Emma, demeaning the scientists whose work undergirds our work is not a polite or useful strategy. Nor is disrespecting the companies. They have a lot more training and resources at their disposal than any of us do, and do a pretty good job of supporting NTs. I'm all for a healthy skepticism, and have in fact chosen not to use certain products because of their restrictions. But we need to be fostering respect and regard for our peers throughout the industry.

I’m not demeaning scientists. As part of my college course we studied physics and electromagnetic spectrum and it is not the lamp itself that cures the gel it’s the UV light emitted from the bulbs. The machine is simply powering the bulbs. I have never came across allergic reactions and gel not curing with non CND lamps. This is my personal opinion based on years of doing nails and client feedback. I don’t have anything against CND I like their products.

 

[NancySyd]

I’m not demeaning scientists. As part of my college course we studied physics and electromagnetic spectrum and it is not the lamp itself that cures the gel it’s the UV light emitted from the bulbs. The machine is simply powering the bulbs. I have never came across allergic reactions and gel not curing with non CND lamps. This is my personal opinion based on years of doing nails and client feedback. I don’t have anything against CND I like their products.

Then what was the purpose of the quotes around "scientist"?

Yes, it is the UV light that cures the gel, but its the lamp that creates the light and directs (directly and through reflection) it onto the nails. And while the machine only powers the bulbs and supply the lights, the bulbs are only part of the equation in producing a proper cure. Hand placement (critical), reflection, and distance are important, which is why so many lamps force a certain placement/distance. How many of us have had bad cures even using the correct lamp because of the dreaded "clench?" And while you may not have come across allergic reactions from improper cures, check out any of the DIY sites like Purse Forum and you'll see lots. Granted, you won't see many involving CND, but that's because CND Shellac is hypoallergenic and contains fewer of the photo initiators that tend to cause sensitivity. Cheap brands tend to contain more of these and present a greater potential for sensitivity.

Again, you have a right to do whatever you want with your business (as long as you don't place your clients or staff at risk). We all reap the consequences of the decisions we make. That's something we ought to make clear to all the new NTs. While your personal opinion and experience is useful, I'd prefer the data from research across many NTs and the advice from real scientists like Schoon and McConnell. Bottom line for me is that insurance won't cover using a non-compliant lamp. It only takes one such incident to ruin a business. The $100-200 difference that it costs to have the compliant lamp is a pittance in that context.

 

[Shauna06]

I don't know what it is about lamp issues that devolves to this so often.

Electronic communications often strips words of their intent. I don't believe she was being rude; she was being emphatic. And she was being emphatic for a reason - this is a health and safety issue. Not using the proper lamp is a particular problem in our industry. It exposes clients and especially NTs to uncured gel. A lot of NTs will say that they've use any ole lamp and haven't seen any problems. But therein lies the problem. There is no easily accessible way to determine whether a proper cure has been achieved. We rely upon the research and science of the manufacturer to assure us that if we've followed the directions, we will have a proper cure.

BTW, Emma, demeaning the scientists whose work undergirds our work is not a polite or useful strategy. Nor is disrespecting the companies. They have a lot more training and resources at their disposal than any of us do, and do a pretty good job of supporting NTs. I'm all for a healthy skepticism, and have in fact chosen not to use certain products because of their restrictions. But we need to be fostering respect and regard for our peers throughout the industry.

‘I was being rude to help get the point across and not to disrespect you.’ This was from Tuans own post.

 

[NancySyd]

‘I was being rude to help get the point across and not to disrespect you.’ This was from Tuans own post.

I think that she was responding to your accusation, not admitting to intentionally being rude. One person's rude is another person emphatic. But the larger point is the information she was trying to get across and the insistence (some might call it rudeness) you showed in not hearing it.

 

[Shauna06]

I think that she was responding to your accusation, not admitting to intentionally being rude. One person's rude is another person emphatic. But the larger point is the information she was trying to get across and the insistence (some might call it rudeness) you showed in not hearing it.

I didn’t accuse her of being rude; did you read the posts? This isn’t my thread. The girl who asked the question said she was being rude and I fully agree with her. Also I don’t think someone agrees to being rude just because they’re accused.

Judging by what you have just written to me, you did not read this thread

 

[tuan]

At this point I really don't care if I came off as rude. Op deserves it after being told about 6 times by 3 different people that you cannot cure gel with a different lamp.

Surprisingly, this sort of stubborn behavior is not uncommon. I know a very good nail tech who reacted the same way after I told her the same thing.

The owner of the salon that I work for brings in well over 100k a year from her business. When I told her that she needs the correct nail lamp for each gel brand, she just said that its ridiculous and that she can't afford it. I just said, "ok cool."

The problem lies in a lack of education. And when the person seeks education, the information is incorrect. Its a big problem. So I actually apologize to OP. Im just trying give you the correct info and sorry if I came off as rude. I was trying to be stern if anything.

BTW, I AM A GUY, NOT A SHE.

 

[EmmaBxx]

Then what was the purpose of the quotes around "scientist"?

Yes, it is the UV light that cures the gel, but its the lamp that creates the light and directs (directly and through reflection) it onto the nails. And while the machine only powers the bulbs and supply the lights, the bulbs are only part of the equation in producing a proper cure. Hand placement (critical), reflection, and distance are important, which is why so many lamps force a certain placement/distance. How many of us have had bad cures even using the correct lamp because of the dreaded "clench?" And while you may not have come across allergic reactions from improper cures, check out any of the DIY sites like Purse Forum and you'll see lots. Granted, you won't see many involving CND, but that's because CND Shellac is hypoallergenic and contains fewer of the photo initiators that tend to cause sensitivity. Cheap brands tend to contain more of these and present a greater potential for sensitivity.

Again, you have a right to do whatever you want with your business (as long as you don't place your clients or staff at risk). We all reap the consequences of the decisions we make. That's something we ought to make clear to all the new NTs. While your personal opinion and experience is useful, I'd prefer the data from research across many NTs and the advice from real scientists like Schoon and McConnell. Bottom line for me is that insurance won't cover using a non-compliant lamp. It only takes one such incident to ruin a business. The $100-200 difference that it costs to have the compliant lamp is a pittance in that context.

I am employed in a salon therefore I am not responsible for buying lamps or insurance so you don’t need to be rude or condescending to me. I studied for 4 years at college to graduate as a beauty therapist so i am entitled to my own opinion based on my own research that I done towards essays etc, but someone that’s done a CND course obviously knows better!

 

[EmmaBxx]

Then what was the purpose of the quotes around "scientist"?

Yes, it is the UV light that cures the gel, but its the lamp that creates the light and directs (directly and through reflection) it onto the nails. And while the machine only powers the bulbs and supply the lights, the bulbs are only part of the equation in producing a proper cure. Hand placement (critical), reflection, and distance are important, which is why so many lamps force a certain placement/distance. How many of us have had bad cures even using the correct lamp because of the dreaded "clench?" And while you may not have come across allergic reactions from improper cures, check out any of the DIY sites like Purse Forum and you'll see lots. Granted, you won't see many involving CND, but that's because CND Shellac is hypoallergenic and contains fewer of the photo initiators that tend to cause sensitivity. Cheap brands tend to contain more of these and present a greater potential for sensitivity.

Again, you have a right to do whatever you want with your business (as long as you don't place your clients or staff at risk). We all reap the consequences of the decisions we make. That's something we ought to make clear to all the new NTs. While your personal opinion and experience is useful, I'd prefer the data from research across many NTs and the advice from real scientists like Schoon and McConnell. Bottom line for me is that insurance won't cover using a non-compliant lamp. It only takes one such incident to ruin a business. The $100-200 difference that it costs to have the compliant lamp is a pittance in that context.

I am employed in a salon therefore I am not responsible for buying lamps or insurance so you don’t need to be rude or condescending to me. I studied for 4 years at college to graduate as a beauty therapist so i am entitled to my own opinion based on my own research that I done towards essays etc, but someone that’s done a CND course obviously knows better!

 

[AlanyaMackie]

Try to leave the gel topcoat to cool for about 1min before you remove the inhibition layer x

 

[EmmaBxx]

At this point I really don't care if I came off as rude. Op deserves it after being told about 6 times by 3 different people that you cannot cure gel with a different lamp.

Surprisingly, this sort of stubborn behavior is not uncommon. I know a very good nail tech who reacted the same way after I told her the same thing.

The owner of the salon that I work for brings in well over 100k a year from her business. When I told her that she needs the correct nail lamp for each gel brand, she just said that its ridiculous and that she can't afford it. I just said, "ok cool."

The problem lies in a lack of education. And when the person seeks education, the information is incorrect. Its a big problem. So I actually apologize to OP. Im just trying give you the correct info and sorry if I came off as rude. I was trying to be stern if anything.

BTW, I AM A GUY, NOT A SHE.

Why are you pointing out the fact you are a guy? Are we all meant to now agree with everything you say because you’re a man?

 

[sarahb1909]

Hello all, I've done a gel set today, left it for longer before I wipe over cured top coat and it looked much better.
Thank you all for the replies and advice. I was certainly not disregarding any advice given but at 40 years old I don't appreciate rudeness when I'm just trying to ask different opinions and advice so I have a few options to try! But apparently I deserve it?!

I certainly didn't want to cause arguments ... everybody is entitled to an opinion and to give advice! Then surely it's up to the person asking what to do with it [emoji4]

 

[tuan]

Oh wait i think i got op mixed up lol. Anyways, you cant cure gel properly by mixing lamps, sheesh!

 

[c.mrsm]

I rang my insurance company today about this because I cannot for the life of me find anywhere that stocks the lamp that goes with my brand, so I'm using a different lamp. I use IBD, the info I got from IBD is that with an led lamp it will cure 'properly' under normal led times. My insurance company have also told me I'm insured for using a different lamp. So this is all really confusing!?! I get the science and I would rather have the right lamp if I could only find one, but I have the manufacturer and the insurance company telling me (for my brand) that mismatching is ok?????

 

[tuan]

I rang my insurance company today about this because I cannot for the life of me find anywhere that stocks the lamp that goes with my brand, so I'm using a different lamp. I use IBD, the info I got from IBD is that with an led lamp it will cure 'properly' under normal led times. My insurance company have also told me I'm insured for using a different lamp. So this is all really confusing!?! I get the science and I would rather have the right lamp if I could only find one, but I have the manufacturer and the insurance company telling me (for my brand) that mismatching is ok?????

Its kind of a complicated situation. First, any brand other than CND, OPI, and maybe Gelish are not good brands.

You can create your own gel polish line for very cheap, but the quality would be extremely low.
A big problem that occurs,not just in the nail industry, is that entrepreneurs will buy low quality products from china and spend money on marketing, because its cheaper than making a good product. These companies will then lie to you about how their products work. For example, they will tell you that curing with any lamp is fine. Its not. Heck, some of them don't even have their own lamps. Again, gels will become hard under any light but they won't cure properly.

I think most people understand that buying a cheaper product will result in poorer results. Here im just explaining why buying cheap isn't good. Unfortunately, IBD is one of those companies that lies. So I would stop using their products.

If you are to get sued, it is almost 100% certain that you will lose in court, that is, if you get sued. But its very rare. The insurance person you talked to just haven't done their homework yet. If they knew the facts and what you are doing, they would immediately stop working with you.

 

[c.mrsm]

I thought IBD was a professional brand, you can't buy in unless your a qualified nail tech. I didn't think it was a cheap one either as I paying £xx.xx per polish. I know shellack is fab and expensive but there will always have to be a cheaper professional option on the market. I'm not disputing what your saying, it makes perfect sense but I'm learning as I've not been doing this very long. Making a lot of expensive mistakes here!



[moderator note: Trade prices removed]

 

[EmmaBxx]

I thought IBD was a professional brand, you can't buy in unless your a qualified nail tech. I didn't think it was a cheap one either as I paying £xx.xx per polish. I know shellack is fab and expensive but there will always have to be a cheaper professional option on the market. I'm not disputing what your saying, it makes perfect sense but I'm learning as I've not been doing this very long. Making a lot of expensive mistakes here!

I think if you’re insurance company is covering you it’s fine. You have to remember some of the people commenting live in the land of Trump where it’s common practice to sue each other for money and for big corporate companies to act like bullies.

 

[BobSweden]

Its kind of a complicated situation. First, any brand other than CND, OPI, and maybe Gelish are not good brands.

What! Are you qualified to make such a sweeping statement? Have you personally tested all the different brands using a rigorous procedure?

 

[BobSweden]

I think if you’re insurance company is covering you it’s fine. You have to remember some of the people commenting live in the land of Trump where it’s common practice to sue each other for money and for big corporate companies to act like bullies.

I would get this in writing from the insurance company. Last year I spoke to the insurance company that works with one of the UK associations, to find out how they determine if a product is professional or not. As it turned out, they had no knowledge or understanding of the main cosmetic regulations (EC 1223/2009), or the importance of using the correct lamp. They asked me to contact their underwriter who created the policy - which I have forgotten to do until I read your post. :-(

 

[BobSweden]

Both the British Association of Dermatologists and the British Society of Cutaneous Allergies have seen a significant increase in allergies due to gels and gel polishes being sold to the public.

"Jason Williams, president of the British Society of Cutaneous Allergies, who was also interviewed and told the BBC: “We’ve seen an increase in the number of patients presenting with problems to these nail systems. Historically we would have seen beauty therapists in salons – people who work with these chemicals for long periods of time – becoming allergic, whereas what we’re seeing now is the end consumer… anecdotally we’re seeing a lot of patients telling us they’re using these home nail kits.”

=> In other words, people who are using UV lamps and gels that are not matched. <=

When organisations like this see a trend, we all need to get worried. This can lead to the nail industry becoming more regulated or worse.