Employee & angry father!

[Only-me]

Unfortuneatly and sorry to say but after 17 years of trainees/and sometimes qualified staff,dealing with the family is the worst part.
Weve had our fair share of nightmare parents over the years and no matter how good the staff member may be at their job,sometimes the ructions it can cause among other staff members and yourself its just not worth it.

Its a sad thing to say and i know its not her fault if her father behaves in this way,however when i started my training at 16,my parents respected the fact that i was growing up and entering into the adult world of work and so pursuaded me to fight my own corner.I would have been mortified if my parents had kicked off like that.And for it then not to even be acknowledged by her is just bizarre behaviour.

Basically if i was in your position,i probably would pay her for the trial day as a thank you but wouldnt take her on permanently.

Others can curse you on here for it,and im sure they will,but instinct is pretty good for these things and if your having trouble now,you will never feel able to treat her like the rest of the staff for fear of her father turning up and causing an issue in your salon.

If she was on a trial etc and the law states you dont have to keep her on and you really feel its more trouble than its worth,do what you feel is right.

No doubt i will be penalised for this post but its my honest opinion and im sticking with it :lick:

Makes sense to me ☺

 

[Tinxy]

Regardless of what else you do I would send a recorded letter to her father explaining to him that with immediate effect he is banned from your premises and any attempt to enter them will be viewed as aggression and will result calling the police.

I would send a letter to the daughter - again recorded - stating all the facts about what and how much she has been paid and why - that as discussed the trial was not to be paid (not something I agree with I'm sorry... even if minimum wage that would be better - you don't have to keep them a full day if you don't feel they are up to scratch after all) and her hours worked were xyz, at rate of £x makes £total. This was taxed at the emergency tax rate as advised by HMRC. You made her payments in 2 instalments as you had admittedly made a mistake with her hours on the thursday amounting to 3 hours.

Any refund from the tax will come to her from the official channels etc.

You're very sorry but unfortunately now your regular therapist is back from holiday you will no longer be requiring her services.


Definitely do not tell other salons about her or her father - it would be slander and you do not want to go there! You can of course refuse to offer a reference for her...

Calling your local station is probably not a bad idea - they will have a non-emergency number. Chances are if he's known for violence then they will already know about him...

 

[tanfastic]

I think it is fine posting on here, as you have not named the people involved.

I also think that this is most definitely the girls fault as well as her fathers. If he is known to be a violent man, then his daughter will know this also. Any information she divulges to him, will be done so with the knowledge that her father will intimidate and bully to get what she wants. I see it as she is 'setting' her father on you. If she did not want this to be happening, she would not be telling him these things. That silly little girl is sat there whispering in to her daddy's ear, and watching him fly. Disgusting.

I think that you need to cut your losses, ask to meet up in a public place with the view of resolving the matter, pay her trial day and then inform her and her psycho dad that they are not welcome in the salon EVER again, and you will be no longer requiring her to work in the salon.

Good luck.xx

My first thoughts exactly, I have a feeling that she is playing you off one against the other, I may be wrong but I doubt it

 

[Harlequin]

Regardless of what else you do I would send a recorded letter to her father explaining to him that with immediate effect he is banned from your premises and any attempt to enter them will be viewed as aggression and will result calling the police.

I would send a letter to the daughter - again recorded - stating all the facts about what and how much she has been paid and why - that as discussed the trial was not to be paid (not something I agree with I'm sorry... even if minimum wage that would be better - you don't have to keep them a full day if you don't feel they are up to scratch after all) and her hours worked were xyz, at rate of £x makes £total. This was taxed at the emergency tax rate as advised by HMRC. You made her payments in 2 instalments as you had admittedly made a mistake with her hours on the thursday amounting to 3 hours.

Any refund from the tax will come to her from the official channels etc.

You're very sorry but unfortunately now your regular therapist is back from holiday you will no longer be requiring her services.


Definitely do not tell other salons about her or her father - it would be slander and you do not want to go there! You can of course refuse to offer a reference for her...

Calling your local station is probably not a bad idea - they will have a non-emergency number. Chances are if he's known for violence then they will already know about him...

I think this is a reasonable idea...but definitely report it to the police first and if you think this man is aggressive enough to ACT (as you stated he is known for his violence) then consider also consulting a lawyer who can advise you if his actions up to now could justify an interdict against him coming to the premises? Or maybe run the letters you want to send by the lawyer to make sure there is nothing they can pick at later...but for the sake of 3 hours work it seems fairly ridiculous that they would even take it so far as to threaten you or your staff.

Just my thoughts...

 

[angel17]

Our salon had a problem with a member of staff years ago and we had to dismiss her. She took us to the employment tribunal and we had mediation between us both. The employee has many rights. My advice is don't quess the correct answer but get professional advice. Good luck

 

[Only-me]

The police will not deal with the issue of her working and payment as that is civil....
But the threatening behaviour is worth reporting..
To be honest this girl knows what hers dads like and she may be fine to your face but remember he is reacting on the info she is giving him - not sure she completely innocent!

101 is the new national number for the police no matter where you live it connects to your local force
Good luck x

 

[lila22]

You know something? I would pay her for the trial day and sack her for gross misconduct in sending her father in to threaten you. Rise above scumbags. They are clearly desperate for the crumbs of what you have.
That days pay cost her a job, stupid chavvy family.
Inform the police the moment any of them set foot in your salon again.

I agree 100% with this, I would def inform police just incase of trouble so they no the situation, good luck hope all ok x

 

[BABSann]

I too think you should pay her for that trial day. I don't agree it's the norm not to pay staff who work a day in a salon, ok if it's a trades test but why should anyone work in your salon for the day and not be paid? Work is work. Did your clients not pay for the treatments she worked? If they did,which im sure they would, then why should you make a profit from her working and she not gain anything for her time during that day?This is something that really annoys me, employers expecting something for nothing. I wouldn't do it to an employee and it's wrong.

Saying that it most certainly does not justify being threatened or having her bad mouth you like that. Yes our kids tell us things, and I've got cross before when mine have told me things that have happened at work and which I know to be wrong, but I wouldn't dream of getting involved. I would advise them but it's for them to choose which path they take.

This girl clearly knew what her father was doing, she is not blameless because you clearly state she told staff what her dad would do should she not be paid etc.

Follow the book, log the details with the police so you have a crime ref number and any details can then be taken up with a tribunal should any issues arise as a result of her not working for you in the future. It may also be wise for you to contact ACAS just to check that you're doing everything by the book to cover yourself in the event of a tribunal.

I think it's a shame really as she sounded a good therapist, let's hope she learns and her father learns that threats of violence or getting involved in his daughters working environment will not lead to a very good future for his daughters work life.

 

[Jess Williams]

Craig! Fancy me reading this post and then seeing it was from you!
Hope business is going well, apart from this recent problem.
Keep in touch x

 

[JoJo1980]

The man is clearly a bully, and more than likely just full of nothing more than hot air.
I dont pay for trial days, and I make this clear, however in this situation Id pay her the hours she has worked then sack her. I know this isnt her fault per say, however it isnt YOUR fault that the poor girl has a hot - headed idiot for a father to guide her.
Poor you! Poor her!....and God bless his wife!!!!!
JoJo
xxxx

 

[classixuk]

Crikey, what a long thread.

You know something? If I were you Craig I'd do the following things:

1. Get yourself a friendly book keeper to do your PAYE and NIS contributions. If you swap your pay period to monthly you will only need to pay for their services a dozen times per year - I'm guessing they'll charge about a fiver tops for each employee. That way your employees pay will always be correctly calculated. It also means that when there 'are' mistakes you can blame it on the book keeper (good cop/bad cop and all that).

2. Give that book keeper your current records of your employees pay, hours worked, deductions, holiday pay etc. and ask them to check if it's all ok so far. If they spot you've overpaid anyone or not taken enough tax etc. they will put it right on the very next pay day.

3. Ask your book keeper to calculate this girl's final pay and issue a P45. Send that sum via cheque along with the P45.

Bobs your uncle. It solves your problem with her and also any future problems you might have due to you not being brilliant at the tax and NI side of things.

 

[lucelasticx]

Pay the girl , then get rid and breathe a huge sigh of relief that they showed their true colours so early on .

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[Duchess]

From a salon owners point of view, I do feel for you and think that the solution of getting wages done by accountant/bookeeper is a very sound idea.

however, i do think you should pay the girl for the day she worked. you did say you were very happy with her - as others say - it is a shame she has such a father.

BUT - my own daughter is just starting out in the industry and has just been had by a nasty salon owner (not saying you are one of those by the way!) who has made a mint from her and her friends working doing massages at a pop festival and then telling them to take her to court for the money. (probably thinks that young girls wont bother).

As a mother all I wanted to do was to confont this person, give her a piece of my mind and basically rip her limb from limb until she paid up. Instead I wrote for help on SG to save my sanity.

Good luck and hope your situation is resolved very soon.

 

[nikkib]

You can also use HMRC's Basic PAYE tools to record PAYE and NICS. You can also use it to submit your end of year if you have less than 9 employees. Its free and calculates everything for you.

 

[craig_studio17]

Hi Guys,

Once again I thank you for all your comments and advice. I have taken absolutely everything on board and will use it to my advantage should an instance such as this occur ever again (fingers crossed it doesn't!)

The matter has now been resolved and hopefully come to an end.

The girl did state to another of my employees that she no longer wanted to work at the salon, she has however not informed me of her decision. After I done wages etc last week, he appeared at the Salon on Saturday morning while I wasn't there demanding to speak to me, and while I was around 40 miles away it clearly wasn't possible.

I send wage slips by email, she wanted hers sent to her Fathers address. After the slip was sent she replied with a threatening email stating that she had not received her trial day pay so her Dad would be down to "see me" on Saturday morning. After having a word with my partner we agreed (rather grudgingly!) just to pay her for the day in order just to end this whole nightmare that she has put us through! I replied with an email stating that there was money for her at the Salon and that she should be there for 9am sharp before any customers where in to pick it up.

She clearly ignored this and sent her Dad down, I had already informed my staff that this may happen. One of them gave him the money and asked him to leave which he did.

Matter closed!

I know I've learnt many lessons through this whole episode I am however struggling to find a way of putting a new procedure into place. I suppose I will need to have a more stringent interview process and perhaps be clearer on the terms and conditions of employment.

For now though I shouldn't need any more staff as the girls I have at the moment are really great!

Thanks

Craig

 

[jcpark]

Glad you've been able to sort the matter and put it behind you, it can't have been a pleasant position to be in.

Can I ask you though, why you 'grudgingly' agreed to pay her for her trial? I'm assuming that she was working on paying clients rather than doing a trade test. If so, why would you not pay someone who has done treatments that clients have paid for? Even though this is a trial period (of a day), she is still earning you money - surely it would be fairer to pay her or do you just keep all the money from treatments she does for you during the trial day?

 

[BABSann]

Glad you've been able to sort the matter and put it behind you, it can't have been a pleasant position to be in.

Can I ask you though, why you 'grudgingly' agreed to pay her for her trial? I'm assuming that she was working on paying clients rather than doing a trade test. If so, why would you not pay someone who has done treatments that clients have paid for? Even though this is a trial period (of a day), she is still earning you money - surely it would be fairer to pay her or do you just keep all the money from treatments she does for you during the trial day?

My sentiments exactly and I seriously believe you would've avoided a lot of this hassle had you just paid the girl what she should've been paid. It seems to me that she was messed around left,right and centre over her wages because of your mistakes and unwillingness to pay her what she clearly should have been paid.

This girl worked a day for you without pay,there's not many people who would've accepted this and not spoken up unless they were just thankful to get the job or too young and naive to speak up.

Letting someone work for a days trial on paying clients but not paying them isn't fair at all. Easy money for the employer I would say. A trades test should be the deciding factor on if you take them on.

Anyway, enough said. I'm just glad she got the money that she deserved, even if it was totally wrongly dealt with on all counts.

 

[craig_studio17]

Glad you've been able to sort the matter and put it behind you, it can't have been a pleasant position to be in.

Can I ask you though, why you 'grudgingly' agreed to pay her for her trial? I'm assuming that she was working on paying clients rather than doing a trade test. If so, why would you not pay someone who has done treatments that clients have paid for? Even though this is a trial period (of a day), she is still earning you money - surely it would be fairer to pay her or do you just keep all the money from treatments she does for you during the trial day?

The reason for this is simple. She was told that it was to be an unpaid day. The reason I wanted her (and the rest of my staff) to complete a full day was to see exactly how they presented themselves as well as see how their skills are as hairdressers or beauticians. People act differently depending on what type of situation they are in. I wanted to see what their mornings routine was as well as customer interaction, handling pressure, upselling and so on. It wasn't so that I could get a free days labour out of anyone. If I'm to invest in someone then I want to know exactly what they can do for my business. It may seem a little extreme to ask someone to complete an entire day for a trial, however one of the lessons which I've learned is that one day isn't enough. That's not to say that I will be asking any future trialists to complete an entire week unpaid it just means that my interview process needs to be a little better.

Another reason why I grudged it was because of the manner in which she demanded it from us. If someone told you to give them £50 (for talking sake) otherwise they're going to punch you, would you really want to give it to them?? My integrity took a little hit and being an ex-soldier my integrity means a lot to me!

However I do understand that in this instance it was beneficial to my business, we're just about 1 month old and having people in my shop scaring my customers and staff is something which every business doesn't need or want! If paying out a few quid meant that the case was closed, then it was worth it!

Thanks

Craig

 

[Baggybear]

My sentiments exactly and I seriously believe you would've avoided a lot of this hassle had you just paid the girl what she should've been paid. It seems to me that she was messed around left,right and centre over her wages because of your mistakes and unwillingness to pay her what she clearly should have been paid.

This girl worked a day for you without pay,there's not many people who would've accepted this and not spoken up unless they were just thankful to get the job or too young and naive to speak up.

Letting someone work for a days trial on paying clients but not paying them isn't fair at all. Easy money for the employer I would say. A trades test should be the deciding factor on if you take them on.

Anyway, enough said. I'm just glad she got the money that she deserved, even if it was totally wrongly dealt with on all counts.

It apears to me that you have not read the whole thread or if you did then you either missed or chose to ignore the fact that the girl was 100% aware that her trial day would be unpaid before she did it and therefore she should not be expecting to be paid for it.

In this industry where there are so many people looking for work and so few jobs it is an employers right to ask for a trial day and if they clearly say it will be unpaid you have the choice to say yes you will do it or no you won't.

If you really want the job then you will do it, and there are many places that have these unpaid trial days.

I don't see how she was continually messed around either, there was 1 mishap with her wages that was sorted quickly once pointed out, there was no need for her dad to get involved.

I'm really glad the issue is resolved for you Craig and I hope you never need deal with similar people again.

 

[lea2721]

It apears to me that you have not read the whole thread or if you did then you either missed or chose to ignore the fact that the girl was 100% aware that her trial day would be unpaid before she did it and therefore she should not be expecting to be paid for it.

In this industry where there are so many people looking for work and so few jobs it is an employers right to ask for a trial day and if they clearly say it will be unpaid you have the choice to say yes you will do it or no you won't.

If you really want the job then you will do it, and there are many places that have these unpaid trial days.

I don't see how she was continually messed around either, there was 1 mishap with her wages that was sorted quickly once pointed out, there was no need for her dad to get involved.

I'm really glad the issue is resolved for you Craig and I hope you never need deal with similar people again.

I dont think its fair at all, its not a set thing in this industrie , i think its silly to think like this, thats what trade test are for and the fact you can employ people on a probationary period so they have so many months to show you, a trial day would show you nothing just like it disnt in this case, its easy to just do your best on one day and then drop it after that.


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