Frizzy and wavy lashes after a perm-what to do?

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Hi Lash perm experts,

HELP!!! Today i just did a lash perm followed by a lash tint, and was horrified to see the after results.

One eyelash came out perfectly curled and the other eyelash came out frizzy and wavy, like a big bend in the middle!!! Eekkk!

This has never happened to me before, and i was sooooo upset to see that and was devastated and embarassed infront of the client and of course didnt charge her. Luckily she was very understanding and even blamed her own eyelashes and said this exact same effect happened to her the last time she had an eyelash perm in another salon....she said something like an electric shock had passed through her eyelashes, but it happened to both of her eyelashes.

I use the clamp shields instead of the rollers, that clamp on to your eyelashes whilst the lotion is on. I followed the normal procedure as always, 8 minutes for each perming and fixing lotion. The lashes were caught nicely and perfectly in the clamps... i always check thoroughly.

I really dont know what could have gong wrong?? was it over processing? was it that the lashes were caught bent in the clamps?? Why was one eyelash perfect, and the other a disaster??

Anyone with some thoughts on what could of happened to avoid this in the future????

I said to her to come back next week, and i can re´do it with just the perming lotion to relax out the wave/frizz???

How can i fix this???? And how long does it take for the lashes to straighten out naturally???

I am actually thinking now to ditch the clamp shields and convert to lash lifts...i have heard many good things about lash lift and that it avoids frizzness?? is that true??? DO i need to go on an lash lift course to offer this service?
 
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elliebee

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What's a clamp shield?

I do loads of lash lifts and have never heard of this
 

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http://www.ambre-esthetique.fr/tarifs/i-curl/

Something like this? It acts like a regular lash curler, you clamp in the eyelashes while the lotion is on.

I live in Spain and bought it from the School i did the course at.
 

elliebee

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Wow! You learn something new every day!

I can't see that these would cause the problem.

When I first started doing lifts, a few clients had a bit of frizz but it was because I hadn't removed the blue lotion properly so they continued processing.

It's strange that she only had it one eye though?

Perhaps that small area wasn't cleansed properly and continued to process whilst the tint was developing?

Sorry I can't offer more advice.
 

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The thing is properly removed the blue lotion, and the frizz effect happened as soon as took off the clamps. So i dont think they continued to process after as the effect was already in place before the tint.

YES SO STRANGE IT HAPPENED TO ONE EYE!!! i´cant figure out what happened??? She said that it happened to her the last time she had a perm done, but both eyelashes got frizzed.

Is there anything i can do to straighten out the bend like frizzes?

I am thinking to ditch these clamps, as i am not so happy with the effect of the curls from these clams, beside the last episode of the frizz!

Thinking to do lash lifts now instread, do they avoid frizz problems?
 

BABSann

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Hi, I don't do lash lifts, just lash perms which basically uses the same products, just you have the clamps and I use rods.

I would suggest the Perming solution has been left on either too long, so over processed, the lashes haven't been position correctly or the product wasn't removed properly from one eye.

I don't think it can be the clients lashes or medication etc because both sets of lashes would be affected. Only one side being frizzy tells me that it is more than likely that you haven't removed your product properly.

Normally if a lash hadn't curled properly on a client I would recommend re doing but for half the time however given theses lashes are actually frizzy I would steer away from this as this tells me they've been over processed and you really don't want the lashes snapping off and becoming really dry.

I would recommend telling the client to use a mascara. This will camouflage the problem. Also tell the client to use a lash conditioner in between to try to get the lashes back into condition. Of course they will naturally be replaced in about 6 weeks. Hth a little.
 

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Thanks for the feedback.
So one eye got over processed it seems, its strange as the blue lotion stayed on the exact same time as the other 8 mins and no more, and i cleaned properly and the effect of the frizzness occured as soon as the clamps came off.

Is frizziness something that happens even though the product stays on for the required time?
 

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oh one question, u think its the perming lotion (pink), or the fixing lotion (blue) that has been left on too long, or both?
 

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They sound over processed to me, was it the eye that was done first that frizzed? Did she let you know in the consultation that it had happened before? My advice would be to advise her to condition her lashes, solar oil can be used on lashes as well as nails. Once her lashes are in a good condition time the treatment to the second :)
 

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No it was the second eye that was frizzed.

I have read on some threads here, you can relax over frizzed or over curled lashes, if you apply the perming lotion and straighten by brushing through with a brow comb and then neutralise using the same technique and cleans and nourish.

Would this work? SHe is very keen to come back next week to fix the problem.
 

elliebee

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I think you may be better popping over to the hair forum for advice.

Although slightly different, lash perming and hair perming products are basically the same.

They will know exactly how the chemicals work and will advise you correctly, rather than us beauty geeks guessing as to what will work best.

We can all give great advice but sometimes you need to ask the specialists! LOL
 

BABSann

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I think you may be better popping over to the hair forum for advice.

Although slightly different, lash perming and hair perming products are basically the same.

They will know exactly how the chemicals work and will advise you correctly, rather than us beauty geeks guessing as to what will work best.

We can all give great advice but sometimes you need to ask the specialists! LOL
If us ' beauty geeks', don't understand how eyelash perms work or the ingredients then we shouldn't be doing the treatment. I am more than qualified to explain the process and what probably went wrong as I already have. I've been Perming eyelashes for many years. If someone came into our salon with frizzy lashes or someone complained their lashes were frizzy after a perm I'm not going to refer them to the hairdressers down the road.

Firstly the first lotion you put on is called a Perming solution this breaks down the hair and softens the inner structure of the hair, it causes the lashes to take on the curl. Then you apply the neutraliser which fixes the eyelash into shape. It would be the Perming solution that has caused the issue.

If you didn't place the clamps correctly then this could have caused crossing over of the lashes which would cause them to be misshapen. If you left on for too long which I think you probably have done, then you will get the fizziness as they have been overdeveloped. Incorrect removal would mean that the product continued developing on the lashes.

Given the lashes aren't just wrongly shaped or curly on the ends I personally wouldn't really like to re perm them. I would simply recommend the client uses a couple of layers of mascara and conditions at night.

Frizziness means they will be dehydrated and in poor condition. Although perm solution for eyelashes in much milder than that used on the head hair, it's still contains chemicals. You really don't want to make matters worse.

It's hard without seeing the lashes to decide what course of action I would take. I have re permed before with excellent results but it would very much depend on the condition of the lashes as to what decision I would take. Hth somewhat.
 
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ilovelashes

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I would phone your school and ask them if they have come across this before. It would also be interesting if you could post a picture x
 

ilovelashes

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Just had a thought. You said she had a similar experience the last time on both eyelashes, how long ago was this? And did they redo it? Am wondering if she has lots of perms in a short space of time which would increase the risk of over processing as I can't see how anything you have done has caused this.

Also have you considered using the silicone pad system? The pad gets glued to the eyelid then the solutions are applied with no stress to the natural lashes.

Also thinking about it I don't think I would touch her lashes again for 6-8weeks to give them time to recover x
 

elliebee

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If us ' beauty geeks', don't understand how eyelash perms work or the ingredients then we shouldn't be doing the treatment. I am more than qualified to explain the process and what probably went wrong as I already have. I've been Perming eyelashes for many years. If someone came into our salon with frizzy lashes or someone complained their lashes were frizzy after a perm I'm not going to refer them to the hairdressers down the road.

Firstly the first lotion you put on is called a Perming solution this breaks down the hair and softens the inner structure of the hair, it causes the lashes to take on the curl. Then you apply the neutraliser which fixes the eyelash into shape. It would be the Perming solution that has caused the issue.

If you didn't place the clamps correctly then this could have caused crossing over of the lashes which would cause them to be misshapen. If you left on for too long which I think you probably have done, then you will get the fizziness as they have been overdeveloped. Incorrect removal would mean that the product continued developing on the lashes.

Given the lashes aren't just wrongly shaped or curly on the ends I personally wouldn't really like to re perm them. I would simply recommend the client uses a couple of layers of mascara and conditions at night.

Frizziness means they will be dehydrated and in poor condition. Although perm solution for eyelashes in much milder than that used on the head hair, it's still contains chemicals. You really don't want to make matters worse.

It's hard without seeing the lashes to decide what course of action I would take. I have re permed before with excellent results but it would very much depend on the condition of the lashes as to what decision I would take. Hth somewhat.
That's put me in my place!!

I don't think I was suggesting anyone sent their lash clients to the hairdresser down the road!

I was only trying to offer constructive advice. I don't think any one day eyelash perming course goes quite into the details of how the different solutions and the chemicals work but I'm sure hairdressers have a far more indepth knowledge of the process.

I think that learning from other professionals on this forum is a wonderful asset and I will never stop asking.

I'm not sure what "more than qualified" means. But as I am merely "qualified" I will bow out of this thread now.

:D
 

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Thanks for the replies. They never covered over -processing or the chemical background and functions of the treatments, or maybe i didnt pick that up correctly in spanish...but i think they did not cover it. That helps a lot, and next time will ensure to time it to the second and clean properly after.

I have also advised my client accordingly.

The silicon pads you are refering to, is that lash lifting? I just received my lash lift kit from lash base ltd.

One question, i was reading a tutorial on how to do a lash lift on this site, and it said that you dont need to remove the perming (pink) lotion before applying the neutraliser (blue lotion)??? But leaving the perming lotion(pink) on for too long, as you said, is what causes the frizziness....so this info cant be right????

COnfused!! Normally i remove both lotions after the required time

http://www.salongeek.com/beauty-tutorials/194164-lash-lifting.html
 

dee

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ok personally i wouldnt use those clamps you would be better with silicon shields ,
speaking as both hairdresser and beauty therapist , it could be a number of things, it could be the clamp has kinked the lashes same as if you do a perm on hair and it isnt wrapped correctly you can get fish hook ends or frizzy ends ,

it could be over processing too , but personally i would think it is the clamps they are awful inventions i dont know how anyone gets a decent result with them , sorry if any lash clamp users get offended at that its my own personal opinion

also you could tell her to keep gettng her lashes wet straight away as this usually will make a perm drop as the bonds are still in a fragile state x

just seen , yes you most definatley remove the perm lotion its a huge part if you dont then you would have messed up lashes if any left at all , lol
 

BABSann

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That's put me in my place!!

I don't think I was suggesting anyone sent their lash clients to the hairdresser down the road!

I was only trying to offer constructive advice. I don't think any one day eyelash perming course goes quite into the details of how the different solutions and the chemicals work but I'm sure hairdressers have a far more indepth knowledge of the process.

I think that learning from other professionals on this forum is a wonderful asset and I will never stop asking.

I'm not sure what "more than qualified" means. But as I am merely "qualified" I will bow out of this thread now.

:D
I have no issues with anyone asking anything. My comment ref,' more than qualified' , was said because you said

Quote'they will know exactly how the chemicals work and will advise you correctly, rather than us beauty geeks GUESSING as to what will work best. We can all give great advice but sometimes you need to ask the specialists' unquote.

I find this quite insulting tbh. I have not guessed any of my replies ever on this forum nor on this thread.

My training went very much into the chemicals used for eyelash perms etc, also on how to deal with corrections if need be. To make such remarks as to the fact that us beauty geeks are merely guessing and better to ask the hair forum as they are specialists is very insulting and yes I did feel I needed to tell you.

I most certainly did not do a one day lash Perming course either so not sure where you got that idea from.

I was not saying you should bow out of anything either. Merely correcting what you have said.

Learning from other professionals is fine, I have helped many and been helped by many on here over the years however I would never guess what ones qualifications are, ie one day course, nor assume that someone's not qualified enough to give advise.

Thanks.
 

dee

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pleasant reminder people .. if you want to discuss things directly please do it through pm's , thank you
 

BABSann

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pleasant reminder people .. if you want to discuss things directly please do it through pm's , thank you
Perhaps a few other people may have wanted to understand that us beauty therapists do actually get told how an eyelash perm works and the chemicals involved, when doing our training. if that had been sent as a pm others may not have known that we do actually know what we are talking about reference eyelash perms.

I may not know about percentages for colouring hair etc, I don't pretend to know, however I and many others do know the principles behind eyelash Perming and tinting.

Also I see thousands of other threads where people are replying to each other, hence the quote facility. Anyway thanks for the pleasant reminder.
 

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