Going lighter

[Hairbyme]

Hi, this is my first post. Please be nice I've been reading the threads on here for a while and found it so useful...you all know your stuff!

Anyway I have a client (family member) who would like to go lighter. From about a level 5 to a very light brown. I've shown her the matrix socolour chart and she likes 8N.

I started hairdressing over 10 years ago so have coloured hair lots over the years, but I've recently returned to college after being a stay at home mum for years, so I'm basically learning everything again and I'm not familiar with any particular brands.

Firstly, my tutor suggested a bleach bath (which I've never done, But happy to try) or stripping the hair. Or my client would also be happy to have it bleached all over first if necessary. Of these, which would you all recommend?

Secondly, as she likes the shade 8N, I would like to get her as close to this as possible. However she wants a light brown, and we're obviously going to be colouring it from a orange/yellow colour, so there's no guarantee that her hair will look like the picture she's seen. So are there any very light browns that you'd recommend, perhaps that will help to eliminate the orange/yellow and also get her to the shade she would like?

I've included the picture she's seen of 8N, which is the colour she would like to achieve.

Hope that all makes sense and thank you.

 

[AcidPerm]

So, do you mean the level 5 is artificial colour or her natural level?
If it’s virgin hair, then go straight in with the 8N.
If it’s coloured, then you need to look at what the natural root colour is compared to mids and ends and formulate for 2 different processes as it’s a colour correction.

I’m amazed that you’ve never done a bleach bath in 10 years, in which case could you do her hair at college under supervision?

 

[Hairbyme]

Hi, this is my first post. Please be nice I've been reading the threads on here for a while and found it so useful...you all know your stuff!

Anyway I have a client (family member) who would like to go lighter. From about a level 5 to a very light brown. I've shown her the matrix socolour chart and she likes 8N.

I started hairdressing over 10 years ago so have coloured hair lots over the years, but I've recently returned to college after being a stay at home mum for years, so I'm basically learning everything again and I'm not familiar with any particular brands.

Firstly, my tutor suggested a bleach bath (which I've never done, But happy to try) or stripping the hair. Or my client would also be happy to have it bleached all over first if necessary. Of these, which would you all recommend?

Secondly, as she likes the shade 8N, I would like to get her as close to this as possible. However she wants a light brown, and we're obviously going to be colouring it from a orange/yellow colour, so there's no guarantee that her hair will look like the picture she's seen. So are there any very light browns that you'd recommend, perhaps that will help to eliminate the orange/yellow and also get her to the shade she would like?

I've included the picture she's seen of 8N, which is the colour she would like to achieve.

Hope that all makes sense and thank you.

Also I am considering 8AV, however the picture looks a lot darker than the one she wants. I know the finished result will depend on what the colour starts as, but since I've never used these before I just wanted to ask someone else's opinion before going ahead.

Thanks again.

So, do you mean the level 5 is artificial colour or her natural level?
If it’s virgin hair, then go straight in with the 8N.
If it’s coloured, then you need to look at what the natural root colour is compared to mids and ends and formulate for 2 different processes as it’s a colour correction.

I’m amazed that you’ve never done a bleach bath in 10 years, in which case could you do her hair at college under supervision?

Thank you so much for your reply. Sorry, it is already coloured. She doesn't have much of a root and it's a similar colour to the rest of her hair. So would you do a bleach bath and then would the 8N be ok to go straight over it?

Regarding the bleach bath, I haven't been hairdressing constantly for over 10 years. I did my level 1 and worked in a few different salons, then did an apprenticeship when I left school so that was very hands on but I didn't fully complete it as I had my eldest daughter. Never got to my level 3 or colour corrections, only what I saw and helped out with in the salons. I was a stay at home mum for about 8 years! I have still done people's hair on and off (just friends and family) but nothing too difficult. Now both of my children are at school so I'm back at college and was also working in a salon on a voluntary basis which has come to an end now. Hope that makes a bit more sense.

 

[AcidPerm]

I don’t want to diminish your enthusiasm but I would strongly recommend you book some colour correction training and consider investing in a book on colour correction that you can refer back to.

As the hairdresser in this scenario, I’d need to know the following:
1. Is the level 5 colour is just a one off application or could it have a build-up of colour if it’s been regularly reapplied?
2. is it a pro job or box dyes. Box dyes are likely to be reapplied all over every few weeks leading to serious colour pigment saturation.
A professional will hopefully have only re-done the roots and used a semi or demi to refresh the mids/ends.
3. what’s the overall condition (porosity) like?
4. How much red is in there?

The problem with using the colour chart to choose a colour is that unless you’re starting with virgin hair, you’re not simply going to be able to apply an 8N and expect it to produce that colour as an even result all over. It’s likely to end up patchy especially if you use a bleach bath to lift out old colour.

Generally, when removing old colour you’ll be left with a raw base colour exposing the underlying orange/yellow pigments. You’d need to allow for toning this as well as choosing the correct tones to reach your target colour.

 

[Hairbyme]

I don’t want to diminish your enthusiasm but I would strongly recommend you book some colour correction training and consider investing in a book on colour correction that you can refer back to.

As the hairdresser in this scenario, I’d need to know the following:
1. Is the level 5 colour is just a one off application or could it have a build-up of colour if it’s been regularly reapplied?
2. is it a pro job or box dyes. Box dyes are likely to be reapplied all over every few weeks leading to serious colour pigment saturation.
A professional will hopefully have only re-done the roots and used a semi or demi to refresh the mids/ends.
3. what’s the overall condition (porosity) like?
4. How much red is in there?

The problem with using the colour chart to choose a colour is that unless you’re starting with virgin hair, you’re not simply going to be able to apply an 8N and expect it to produce that colour as an even result all over. It’s likely to end up patchy especially if you use a bleach bath to lift out old colour.

Generally, when removing old colour you’ll be left with a raw base colour exposing the underlying orange/yellow pigments. You’d need to allow for toning this as well as choosing the correct tones to reach your target colour.

1. The level 5 could be slightly built up. It was done last about 6 weeks ago.
2. She has previously used box dyes, not had it professionally done.
3. Condition is quite good. As I said she has used box dyes, but only now and again.
4. There will be some red undertones from previous dyes she's used. The last dye she used was Garnier nutrisse natural brown.

Thanks, well I am training hence being at college. I can't do it at college though due to the clients committments, however I have asked my tutor for advice and she's happy for me to do it. I just want to do the best job I can. I don't have much experience in colour corrections at all but I've done lots of research and we all have to start somewhere. I wouldn't say I'm enthusiastic about it, probably stressed more than anything!

I have told her that she won't get that shade as her hair is previously coloured. That's why I wondered if anyone could recommend shades that could tone the orange/yellow. I thought maybe 8av?

Thank you.

 

[ronray]

1. The level 5 could be slightly built up. It was done last about 6 weeks ago.
2. She has previously used box dyes, not had it professionally done.
3. Condition is quite good. As I said she has used box dyes, but only now and again.
4. There will be some red undertones from previous dyes she's used. The last dye she used was Garnier nutrisse natural brown.

Thanks, well I am training hence being at college. I can't do it at college though due to the clients committments, however I have asked my tutor for advice and she's happy for me to do it. I just want to do the best job I can. I don't have much experience in colour corrections at all but I've done lots of research and we all have to start somewhere. I wouldn't say I'm enthusiastic about it, probably stressed more than anything!

I have told her that she won't get that shade as her hair is previously coloured. That's why I wondered if anyone could recommend shades that could tone the orange/yellow. I thought maybe 8av?

Thank you.

I would be more inclined to do a full head of fine slices lift as light as you can and then tone all over. It's hard to gage what toner you will need really until the hair is lightened. Just strip it back to basics.
Yellow - violet
Orange - blue
Red - green
So if it only lifts to a orange you will need a blue based level 7 toner. If it lifts to yellow you'll probably need a violet based level 8 toner.

 

[Kerrig]

Half head of foils using pre lightener with 10 vol and 20 vol with a baylage technique on the ends with 10 vol (keep an eye on pre lightener, no matter if you choose to go low!) To give a brighter look. Then toned with 10.2 violet ash.