Help, Scubfresh has paraben in it which I read is toxic

[franjess]

Just got Brisa Gels! Can any one tell me if i can use lsopropyl alcohol, mix with acetone,and bethyl acetate to use in place of scrub fresh by creative? I'm tring to have a non toxic Home base salon and have read that paraben in scrub fresh is a toxen which can cause health problems (allergies ect. and its a endocrine disrupter). i looked up on web "paraben toxic" to get lots of info links on it. :cry:

 

[VHunter]

I suppose too much of anything can be toxic to you.

But I highly doubt that Parabens are toxic since they are found in MOST cosmetics, including: creams, lotions, sunscreens, moisturizers, foundations... etc etc etc..

Have a look at this,plenty of food for thought:
Parabens - Safe and Non Toxic says Chemical Industry?

However, for some people who have hyper sensitive skin (allergic) - like myself - Parabens can be irritants.
But interesting to note, just to put some perspective on this: my sister is allergic to poison ivy.... I, however, could lay in it naked and not get a single spot on my skin.
Just because some people have adverse reactions to something, doesn't make it 'bad' for everyone.

Sometimes the internet can be our saviour, and sometimes our worst enemy with all the crazy scare mongering, sensationalism, and rumours that are so abundant.

Sooooo I really don't think it's necessary that you try to mix your own chemicals to make a nail cleanser.

hth's

 

[Martin Duffy]

The bottom line is that the science behind that extremely small & preliminary study was weak. They found parabens in the breast tissue, but that does not mean the parabens caused the tumour - there was no conclusion of cause & effect. The belief parabens can act like estrogen is based on one single published paper, which is in stark contrast to the overwhelming number of papers showing it to be safe.

You'll note most of those jumping on the parabens are evil bandwagon also have a parabens free product to flog - creating a market through scare-mongering one might cynically suggest!

The amount of parabens in cosmetics is miniscule in comparison to the amounts being talked about in this study, in fact there's more parabens in most food stuffs than cosmetics. Not only is it added to many foods it also occurs naturally in many plants as many plants make it as a means to protect their fruit from spoiling, thus everytime you eat an apple, blackcurrant, carrot, onion or grape you are consuming parabens, and even though parabens in skin products are synthetically produced they are mostly nature-identical.

Furthermore, consider the even tinier amount of parabens that you'll be using in a product such as ScrubFresh & the far greater risk to be had from the microbes should no preservative be used.

 

[ValencianNails]

http://www.salongeek.com/skin-geek/62690-parabens-cosmetics-2.html#post662770

If Parabens were dangerous, CND would not use them. We use them because, 1. Parabens have a very long history of safe use and 2. Parabens prevent the growth of bacteria and other microorganisms in our products and improve shelf-life.

The above link will make for interesting reading, especially as you mentioned Scrubfresh in the title of the thread.

 

[weezie]

The bacteria and microorganisms that would grow without the parabens would be toxic! This paraben fear is unfounded. I went to a chemist and asked "do you have any products with papaya in" and the woman said "ohhh papaya that's that dangerous ingredient isn't it" I said I think you're thinking of parabens and it's not factually sound! A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing.

 

[Ruth Mills]

According to the MSDS data sheets at the Physical and Theoretical Chemistry Laboratory at Oxford University, it would appear that Acetone is more toxic than Propylparaben! You'd need less than half as much acetone to kill a mouse than you would propylparaben anyway! And the general toxicological blurb concerning acetone has nastier things in it than that for propylparaben. e.g. acetone can cause permanent eye damage (corneal clouding), and long-term exposure may cause liver damage! Whereas propylparaben is just an irritant, apparently.

MSDS for acetone (propanone) - Safety (MSDS) data for propanone

MSDS for propylparaben (propyl 4-hydroxybenzoate) - Safety (MSDS) data for propyl 4-hydroxybenzoate

 

[VHunter]

According to the MSDS data sheets at the Physical and Theoretical Chemistry Laboratory at Oxford University, it would appear that Acetone is more toxic than Propylparaben! You'd need less than half as much acetone to kill a mouse than you would propylparaben anyway! And the general toxicological blurb concerning acetone has nastier things in it than that for propylparaben. e.g. acetone can cause permanent eye damage (corneal clouding), and long-term exposure may cause liver damage! Whereas propylparaben is just an irritant, apparently.

MSDS for acetone (propanone) - Safety (MSDS) data for propanone

MSDS for propylparaben (propyl 4-hydroxybenzoate) - Safety (MSDS) data for propyl 4-hydroxybenzoate

So, I supposed, on that note: if one is afraid of the parabens, then we should be petrified of acetone and not ever paint our nails

:lol:

I'm not mocking you, Ruth (just in case you wondered), just making an observation

:hug:

 

[Ruth Mills]

So, I supposed, on that note: if one is afraid of the parabens, then we should be petrified of acetone and not ever paint our nails

:lol:

I'm not mocking you, Ruth (just in case you wondered), just making an observation

:hug:

LOL, I know what you mean

Of course, just down the road from the Physical and Theoretical Chemistry Laboratory at Oxford is the Dyson Perrins Laboratory, where, during undergraduate organic chemistry practical experiments, we used to slosh shed loads of acetone around (we used it for cleaning laboratory glassware amongst other things) - and used to come out reeking of the stuff at the end of the day!!! So it can't be that bad if they let students do that with it!!! We got through loads more acetone in the lab than I've ever needed for taking my nail polish off anyway!

 

[ValencianNails]

LOL, I know what you mean

Of course, just down the road from the Physical and Theoretical Chemistry Laboratory at Oxford is the Dyson Perrins Laboratory, where, during undergraduate organic chemistry practical experiments, we used to slosh shed loads of acetone around (we used it for cleaning laboratory glassware amongst other things) - and used to come out reeking of the stuff at the end of the day!!! So it can't be that bad if they let students do that with it!!! We got through loads more acetone in the lab than I've ever needed for taking my nail polish off anyway!

In all fairness... the acetone you used would have more than likely been different to what we use in a salon environment, ie industrial acetone vs buffered acetone for use on the skin of clients, wouldn't it?
Or am I totally wrong on this one? :lol:

 

[VHunter]

Even then, I'm assuming that industrial acetone is harsher than 'salon' acetone; and since Ruth was exposed the industrial stuff in vast quantities and suffered no ill............... could we not assume that we are quite safe with the salon variety?
Especially considering what our Doug has had to say on the very subject of accetone. :wink2:

ummm curiouser, perhaps we should pick his brain about parabens too?

 

[Ruth Mills]

In all fairness... the acetone you used would have more than likely been different to what we use in a salon environment, ie industrial acetone vs buffered acetone for use on the skin of clients, wouldn't it?
Or am I totally wrong on this one? :lol:

Well, it would still contain the same stuff, as in (CH3)2CO - but, yes, I'd imagine that the acetone that we used in the lab would have a greater number of impurities than the salon grade product. Yet the MSDS would be referring to the toxicity of acetone itself.

However, a product such as Scrubfresh will contain other ingredients as well as acetone (according to the MSDS I have located for it via Google, http://quabieu.com/msds/creativemsds/Scrubfresh.pdf - it is essentially a 50/50 mix of isopropanol and acetone, with less than 1% each of butyl acetate and various parabens).

Incidentally, the Creative MSDS for Scrubfresh does mention the risk of corneal burns from getting acetone in the eyes, so it would concur with the Oxford MSDS in terms of that.

 

[franjess]

Thanks for the info and web links they were helpful, but because there is still some confussion on safety i would like to know if i could use something else in place of scrubfresh like alcohol or something? i know its very dring. As long as its not toxic. i also hate using acetone products to soak off enhancements,thats a long time to soak in toxin. I'm looking for safer products to use in place of possible toxic products. I know from many years of studing health that most products we use today have toxic products in them, hard to avoid but when i can i do. I also inform my clients so they can make better choices on whats best for them. I'm a liecensed Cosmatologist and been doing nails and some hair for over 20 years, i have some health problems i think is link to the nail business. Just started doing Brisa gels hoping its safer then L&P (gas, vapors, drill & dust). Was out of the business since 1992 and started back 1 1/2 years ago. I'm tring to catch up with whats out there.

 

[Martin Duffy]

There is no such thing as an entirely safe chemical, everything in some quantity & some individuals has the potential to be harmful.

The bottomline is that a product has to contain a preservative else you are at risk of illness & death caused by microbes. Far better use one that has a long proven track-record of being safe than the many unproven alternatives that could be far worse.

 

[xAnnaBannAx]

Thanks for the info and web links they were helpful, but because there is still some confussion on safety i would like to know if i could use something else in place of scrubfresh like alcohol or something? i know its very dring. As long as its not toxic. i also hate using acetone products to soak off enhancements,thats a long time to soak in toxin. I'm looking for safer products to use in place of possible toxic products. I know from many years of studing health that most products we use today have toxic products in them, hard to avoid but when i can i do. I also inform my clients so they can make better choices on whats best for them. I'm a liecensed Cosmatologist and been doing nails and some hair for over 20 years, i have some health problems i think is link to the nail business. Just started doing Brisa gels hoping its safer then L&P (gas, vapors, drill & dust). Was out of the business since 1992 and started back 1 1/2 years ago. I'm tring to catch up with whats out there.

With respect I think you need to a lot more research and a lot more catching up....the products we use are not toxic...all our products are safe to use when used correctly and with the correct procedures.

You do sound to me like you have an 'unhealthy' interest/obsession in locating 'toxic-less' products almost like your scared of the products we use so must find supposedly safe alternatives...which leads me on to feeling you will and albeit maybe unintentionally likely to scare your clients and other people away from the rest of us and giving us a bad name....the incorrect terminology you use, ideas you seem to have and the 'unhealthy obsession for avoiding danger'...I wonder what exactly you are informing your clients so that they 'make a better choice' ???......there are enough problems as it is trying to convince people that it is safe to have their nails done and it will not cause them or their nails any damage etc

Hey this is just my opinion I may be way off the mark but it does seem to me like you may need to do quite a bit of catching up!....perhaps you should put more efforts into gathering the correct and up to date knowledge.

 

[Vetty]

Just got Brisa Gels! Can any one tell me if i can use lsopropyl alcohol, mix with acetone,and bethyl acetate to use in place of scrub fresh by creative? I'm tring to have a non toxic Home base salon and have read that paraben in scrub fresh is a toxen which can cause health problems (allergies ect. and its a endocrine disrupter). i looked up on web "paraben toxic" to get lots of info links on it. :cry:

Why don't you contact CND direct (www.cnd.com) and ask them the questions? They will be much better placed to give you the actual facts on their products IMO.

 

[VHunter]

I feel that you are making "much ado about nothing".
I don't mean offense, but if you want to avoid toxins... then don't do nails. Don't eat. Don't bathe and don't wear makeup. And omg, DON'T BREATHE.

There is a website Skin Deep: Cosmetic Safety Reviews that will list 'toxins' and 'carcinogens' for just about every makeup, hand lotion, soap, moisturizer, shower gel, etc etc out there.


How about Dove soap? Think it's great for your skin? Lovely PH balance, etc etc? Dermatologists recommend it...
As per the above mentioned site, PLEASE read this: http://www.cosmeticsdatabase.com/product.php?prod_id=163637

Johnsons & Johnsons Baby shampoo..... safe for baby?
http://www.cosmeticsdatabase.com/product.php?prod_id=147083

If you read the above two links, you should be freaking out, right about now.

ALCOHOL can be toxic, if not used correctly.

I think perhaps you need to have a realistic grasp on the meaning of the word 'toxic'.

To define toxic:

Having a chemical nature that is harmful to health or lethal if consumed or otherwise entering into the body in sufficient quantities
en.wiktionary.org/wiki/toxic
toxicity - the degree to which something is poisonous
toxicity - perniciousness: grave harmfulness or deadliness
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn
Toxics - Toxicity is the degree to which a substance is able to damage an exposed organism. Toxicity can refer to the effect on a whole organism, such as a human, bacterium, or plant, as well as the effect on a substructure of the organism, such as a cell (cytotoxicity) or an organ (organotoxicity) such ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toxics

Please note above, the words "the degree to which" or "sufficient quantities".
As I said earlier.....ANYTHING can be toxic if there's too much of it.

You need to worry more about the germs that are on your client's hands when he/she walks in the door than you do about the 'toxity' of scrubfresh. And if you're worried about toxity, then OMG.... don't ask them to wash their hands with soap... it might poison them.

 

[franjess]

:cry:I seam to have, offended some of you,(sorry) Maybe you haven't had health problems as a result of doing nails for many years as i have. I'm glad to read on this site that of how to keep yourself and clients safer by proper use of products and environment (air purifiers). I never used mma products or drills, but i never had an air purifiers either. I worked in a salon, working 3 days, 12 hrs.a day and none stop L&P, very few man. or ped. Please everyone follow the advice on this site of proper use of products keeping station clean and keeping vapors and gases down and products off skin. I love the professionalism of this site and its desire to help others, that's what I'm all about, I'm not trying to scare clients away from you. Hopefully this makes new techs aware of how important it is to go with a proven company that researches their product safety and not go for cheapest out there. Also I have read all the links you pointed out to me and more being careful to look at pros and cons of each product debates, and would advices others to do the same just to be informed on what they're working with. Customer are becoming more informed on health issue and may ask you about the products your using and you need to be able to answer them. Oh i forgot to tell you i do reflexology and know how points in hand and feet connect to organs in body. Great thing to learn to do on self or others. Love you guys (sorry about spelling)

 

[Jeni Giles]

ANYTHING can be toxic when over used. Water is toxic if used incorrectly, drink too much or inhale it and it will kill you. The big message is work safely, using the manufacturer's guidelines, and you will be fine.

Take time to read a food lable, it might surprise you, you will find parabens, or a paraben derivative, in many foods, they are excellent preservatives as well as bacterial/anitfungal agents to prevent spoilage and extend shelf life.

I know people who haven't worked safely and as a result developed allergies, and I know people (myself included-I literally grew up in the salon) who have been in the industry life long working safely and not develop any allergies. It really boils down to following safety instructions published and available from the manufacturer. Follow their directions, to the letter, and you won't have issues. Reputable companies spend time, energy and loads of money researching a product before it ever comes to the professional market, they know and make users aware of potential hazards or risks as well as safety measures to avoid them.

 

[nailzoo]

So I guess i'll have to stop drinking my Scrubfresh and tonic and go back to Vodka!!!!!

 

[Jolicatellas]

Thanks for the info and web links they were helpful, but because there is still some confussion on safety i would like to know if i could use something else in place of scrubfresh like alcohol or something? i know its very dring. As long as its not toxic.

Here's a site that might be of interest:
www.cosmeticdatabase.com
type in the word you want to search for information.

Here in Oz I've hardly heard of scrubfresh...?

Nail techs are going to face hazards in the work place, our stock is full of various chemicals as well as good stuff. You can try to minimize the effects, especially if you're having health concerns by using vodka mixed with water for cleaning & vinegar for nail infections. Though, I won't work on infected nails.