Rights as self employed taking a holiday

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BethanFrancesca

Beauty1988
Joined
Jul 10, 2017
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Location
Bath
Hi,

I have been working at my salon for just over 2 years on a self employed basis where I give the salon owner a % of my earnings. I give her 20% for semi permanent makeup and mesotherapy because I pay for all my equipment and products, but for waxing, lash lifts and brow treatments I give her 50% because she buys the products.

During my time there I have heard from her and the staff that she charges the staff for taking holidays, originally she charged them £20 a day. So far she's never charged me for a holiday and I assumed that it was because I wasn't full time and didn't have a set station like the nail girls do as I just use whatever treatment room is available. But recently she has been charging all the girls for taking holidays, even including the receptionist who she pays £50 a day and then a % over £100 takings, but also the new beauty therapist who is on the same deal as me.

I am now worried she's going to charge me for my holidays as she seems to be doing it across the board now. She's now charging £16 a day for holidays.

All of us, except the receptionist who is paid £50 a day, are self employed and none of us have contracts with her at all.

I'm sure she can't charge us for not being there when we are self employed?? We can choose when we work, that's the whole point of being self employed! It's not like I even pay a daily or weekly rent... And I have no contract anyway!

At the end of the day we are choosing not to work and lose out on income for the time we are on holiday, surely it's not legal for me to then be charged by her?

I know it's just because she'll be losing potential income too, but if she was worried about that she could have chosen to employ staff rather than having self employed staff surely?

One of the girls in the salon never takes holidays because by the time she's paid for her holiday etc, and then pays the £16 a day it makes her holiday so much more expensive!

I want to be prepared for her trying to charge me for my holiday so want to know my legal standing with it, does anyone know where I could find out the actual legal rights I have? So I can be fully informed and be able to have an air tight defense?

She told me that one of the girls was moaning about the 'retainer' as she calls it, and she said "it's not like you ring your landlord and say 'I'm going on holiday for a week so I don't want to pay that weeks rent'"... But we don't pay her a rent... we pay her a %! And we don't have a contract.

I know I could just find another salon if I don't agree with her, but I've built up a good clientele there and overall I enjoy working there, so would rather have legal rights to put to her to overcome this issue.

Any advice or experience with this is greatly appreciated. Thank you!
 
Think of it this way, when you go on holiday you still have to pay rent or mortgage. So does your boss on her salon if she is off. If you want to keep your room then you should expect to cover its costs whilst away or she could easily rent it to someone else.
 
Think of it this way, when you go on holiday you still have to pay rent or mortgage. So does your boss on her salon if she is off. If you want to keep your room then you should expect to cover its costs whilst away or she could easily rent it to someone else.

I am not renting a room though, I have no contract and I simply give her a % of the treatments I do. I don't pay a rent and I'm only working 4 days a week, until recently i was only working 1 or 2 days a week.

I don't have my own room, I just use which ever room is available, we all flit between them depending on what we are doing and what is available. If the rooms are all booked up I can't do any treatments... so in those circumstances I'm losing out on potential income too because the rooms are all used. Because I don't have my own room...

The equipment is all hers, apart from the stuff I take in for semi permanent makeup and mesotherapy which I just take in a suitcase on the days I have those treatments.

Also, I am still building my clientele and some days I don't have any bookings or walk ins, so make no money, for either of us, but she doesn't charge me then, because I'm not on a rental...
 
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Hi Bethan

This is why you should always have a contract in place, whether you are an employee or self employed. It just means everyone is clear as to the arrangement.

As a self employed person entering into a relationship with another business, the terms of that relationship can be anything; you are not protected in the same way as being an employee.

Often the term 'renting a chair' or 'renting a room' are just terms to mean a self employed person renting the right to a work area or work station within a salon (which is what you are doing). So the percentage you pay her is considered a rent.

I would suggest that you chat to the owner and discuss the terms to your arrangement and get a clear contract in place.

The owner has also put themselves at risk too without a contract. If HMRC visit and deem that you are not self employed but are all in fact employees, this will have a number of expensive implications for the owner. A good test to this is to go through the HMRC/NHF self employed test which you can see in one of the sticky threads.

How long have you been there? A contract can be in action as well as in writing. The terms of a contract can become 'accepted' on both sides after a while even if not written. You'd have to seek legal help though if you wanted to go down that route, which it sounds like you don't.

So in summary, just chat to the owner and see what's what; then take it from there.
 
Hi Bethan

This is why you should always have a contract in place, whether you are an employee or self employed. It just means everyone is clear as to the arrangement.

As a self employed person entering into a relationship with another business, the terms of that relationship can be anything; you are not protected in the same way as being an employee.

Often the term 'renting a chair' or 'renting a room' are just terms to mean a self employed person renting the right to a work area or work station within a salon (which is what you are doing). So the percentage you pay her is considered a rent.

I would suggest that you chat to the owner and discuss the terms to your arrangement and get a clear contract in place.

The owner has also put themselves at risk too without a contract. If HMRC visit and deem that you are not self employed but are all in fact employees, this will have a number of expensive implications for the owner. A good test to this is to go through the HMRC/NHF self employed test which you can see in one of the sticky threads.

How long have you been there? A contract can be in action as well as in writing. The terms of a contract can become 'accepted' on both sides after a while even if not written. You'd have to seek legal help though if you wanted to go down that route, which it sounds like you don't.

So in summary, just chat to the owner and see what's what; then take it from there.

Thank you. Yes I agree that we should have a contract, she's talked about it before but has never implemented them because she knows she'll have to abide by the law more as she pays the receptionist less than minimum wage etc already. But I'd love a contract to be in place so we both know where we stand, so I will suggest this if we can't come to an agreement on this holiday charge.

I've been there over 2 years now and she's never charged me for holidays before, I was only aware of this charge to others because they asked if I was charged the same, and because she said one of them was moaning about it, but she'd never mentioned it to me that I would have to pay it so I assumed that they had a rental agreement for their work station that is solely theirs, where as I don't have a set space or pay a flat rent. And I'm not even guaranteed a space when I'm there because we have too many beauty therapists for the amount of rooms so at times the rooms may all be booked up and I then can't do any clients...

So in my eyes, because she's never told me I have to pay the holiday charge and has never charged me before, that that is in fact a contract as such. If she now wants to charge me (I believe because she's struggling for money and is trying to claw back some money by saying she's doing it for everyone to make it fair), then thats a change in contract and something we would need to renegotiate.

But I think she sees me as a bit disposable, as someone else who has recently joined the salon who can do the treatments I do (But we agreed that she wouldn't because she does a lot of other things so we agreed that I'd be able to keep my own treatments), so I'm worried about going down the route of saying I'll just leave because I don't really want to and has the upper hand because I am replaceable to a certain extent (even though I know a lot of my clients would find me and come to me elsewhere). I just don't think it's fair to suddenly start charging me for something she's never actually told me I have to pay for and has never charged me for before.

I just wanted to know my rights on it, if any, so I could have a solid defence, but I guess my defence is simply that she's never charged me before so she can't Willy nilly change that just because it suits her...
 
Without a contract, she can try whatever she wants. Whether you agree is a different matter. It may come to you either paying or leaving. It doesn't sound like an ideal place for you, if after 2 years you are still having days with no clients, and sometimes don't have an area to do treatments.
 
Without a contract, she can try whatever she wants. Whether you agree is a different matter. It may come to you either paying or leaving. It doesn't sound like an ideal place for you, if after 2 years you are still having days with no clients, and sometimes don't have an area to do treatments.

But as you said... "The terms of a contract can become 'accepted' on both sides after a while even if not written." Which by never charging me before would meet this...

I've only got the odd day I don't have clients because I've only just gone from 1 day a week (sometimes 2) to 4 days a week so I've spread myself out a bit more.

Anyway I will talk to her and see what she says and it may by that I will leave.

Thank you for your help
 
But as you said... "The terms of a contract can become 'accepted' on both sides after a while even if not written." Which by never charging me before would meet this...

I've only got the odd day I don't have clients because I've only just gone from 1 day a week (sometimes 2) to 4 days a week so I've spread myself out a bit more.

Anyway I will talk to her and see what she says and it may by that I will leave.

Thank you for your help

Good luck. See what she says, put your point across, then if it doesn't go your way, retreat for a few days and consider your options before deciding what to do. IMHO. :)
 
....And I'm not even guaranteed a space when I'm there because we have too many beauty therapists for the amount of rooms so at times the rooms may all be booked up and I then can't do any clients...
...(even though I know a lot of my clients would find me and come to me elsewhere)....
I just wanted to know my rights on it, if any, so I could have a solid defence, but I guess my defence is simply that she's never charged me before so she can't Willy nilly change that just because it suits her...

If you don't have a guaranteed space in which to run your business, why are you there?

Your post reads to me that both you and the salon owner act as though you are employed.

If you're self employed, legally they're your clients so only you should hold their contact details and other data and so you just inform them of your new location. If you're not keeping their records, you're both breaking the law.

I think it sounds like a possible sham employment arrangement and you'd be better off out of there and properly running your own business.
 

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