Working illegally

[Simba44]

The harm personally done to someone's daughter
I agree is massively different however both drug dealer and tax evader are both doing something to make illegal money, they both can have a custodial sentence, tax fraud means you will have to pay any tax you owe and potentially also be fined upto 100% of the monies owed. If beauty procedures including acrylic nails are not performed correctly or health and safety guide lines are not being followed this could end up seriously harming somebody, isn't this the reason why legal nail techs spend hours and hours or their lifes training to become qualified? these jobs aren't easy and if they where anyone would just do it.

Exactly criminal offence is direct with intent but tax evading is civil offence reclaiming redress against the plaintiff

 

[smooth]

fwiw if I was in this position I would report them as an individual and try and rally a collective as well. I say this because I would want to take personal responsibility in doing my utmost to protect the publilc from rogue traders when such risks are being taken.

I wouldn't feel bad about whether they knew it was me or not because I believe it would be acting in the best interests of everyone concerned, the public, fair trading practitioners and the authorities.

Whether that helps you or not I don't know, but it's not a nice decision to have to make and I think you should listen to whatever your gut instinct is telling regarding your own moral compass.

There is professional responsibility with all involved to be honest to protect the public, I have thought long and hard and know I and everyone else need to report them but it was just whether to do it collectively or have individual cases from all of us.

Joint effort is better because the law is better armed to act when they have more then one persons word. However, you either need evidence or you need to be able to tell the law where the evidence is and you need to be 100% certain that the law is being broken.
For example, I watched a program last night about botox etc and it was explained that at the moment it is not law that a medical person gives these injections, a medical person must write the prescription but any one can do the treatment, it went on to explain why this is not wise, that a lot of knowlege of muscle and nerve placement is needed to make it a safe treatment but, as the law stands anyone can do it and because clients sign a contract giving their permission if anything goes wrong, they don't have a leg to stand on.
Would I tell? Yes, we are never going to get better standards in this country if we don't stand up and demand it. Would I tell the ss if my neighbour had her boyfriend staying 5 nights a week instead of 3? No, would I shop someone for working full time and claiming benifit, yes.
Would I turn a blind eye to someone selling stolen goods? No.
In short, it what's going on is hurting or going to hurt someone else, even if it's just by makeing it harder for someone else to make a benifit claim, yes, if they are just trying to live their lives the best way they can, no.
I don't envy you Smooth, but I do think you have to talk to someone official about this.

Botox Britain? Watched it last night and it was pretty rubbish to be honest. Even though anyone can administer in some very strict given circumstances, there still is a number of legal requirements that have to be adhered to and as soon as you go against those, you are breaking the law. The evidence is actually from the person acting illegally believe it or not, in writing too!!!!! Also, anyone can go and see them acting illegally, they are doing it blatantly.

The whole consent thing is a different matter, even though a consent is signed if malpractice is evident then you can be successfully sued. People can't rely solely on consent forms as they will stand up in some but not all circumstances.

 

[dandelionpoppy]

This could have just been a TPT but as it happens, I have been privvy to some information which I wish I hadn't be made aware of. Well I will expand a little, illegal as in what they are doing with medicine, making decisions when they shouldn't, so potentially being very dangerous as well as illegal!! They do not have the knowledge, experience or qualification to be doing what they are doing and to top it all, they are not very nice (personally) at all AND they have been warned by plenty of others and received a warning from the authorities yet they are still carrying out an illegal act.

I'm not mentioning names, location, profession etc but they do seem to ignore the prescribing law and medicine regulations. So the public are potentially at risk yes, should be it just be down to one person to report them or make it a joint effort?

If there is any chance of someone (client) being put in physical danger then I would report it. If there is a professional association that you belong to I would make that my first port of call. I personally think it's irrelevant that he/she is not a nice person; I'm sure you're right, but that's not the issue and by mentionng it may weaken your case. xx

 

[smooth]

If there is any chance of someone (client) being put in physical danger then I would report it. If there is a professional association that you belong to I would make that my first port of call. I personally think it's irrelevant that he/she is not a nice person; I'm sure you're right, but that's not the issue and by mentionng it may weaken your case. xx

I know it is irrelevant but it was carrying on from a previous comment really sorry if it was confusing. Anyway, my professional body won't get involved as they are not members so it is straight to the eyes of the law with this one. Colleague is pushing to police report, others to medicine regulations xx

 

[Simba44]

Tax evading is a civil offence not criminal dealt by the police. Benefit cheat is civil offence
Drug dealing banned class of drugs is a criminal offence dealt with by the police.
Theft is a criminal offence dealt with by the police.
There is a massive difference between civil and criminal.
In criminal law the burden of proof is that guilt must be shown beyond all reasonable doubt. Whiles in civil law the burden of proof is that liability must be shown on the balance of probabilities. Unless somebody reports they have been harmed as a result of intent the police will not investigate, it therefore can be raised in a civil court by the DWP or INLAND REVENUE.

 

[vitality]

If someone is working illegally and I don't just mean without certificate, insurance etc I actually mean breaking the law which can result in prison/fine, what would you do? Would you report them or just keep your nose to the ground and ignore?

I would report them if it risked the health of clients. I would hate the thought of a trusted 'professional' to be acting with negligence on my friends, family etc.

 

[Simba44]

I would report them it risked the health of clients. I would hate the thought of a trusted 'professional' to be acting with negligence on my friends, family etc.

Hit the nail on the head. They build a huge collaboration of evidence and the penalties are longer and harsher than that of a criminal offence, Fact!

 

[sugar&spice]

The problem is that there everywhere ! I had one girl steal contents from my site and fb page frm pics to prices! I rang the tax office who couldn't tell me if her business was registered but gave them details as she wasn't paying any tax!

She rang up me up being nasty threatened to burn my house down lol

All of her clients have come to me as 2 of the womens nails were awful. But 1 women said she was put off by the fact she asked questions about her treatments and she wasnt in depth with her answers

 

[CRScissorhands]

For me, there is no question of whether or not to report when there are prescriptions involved, it must be done.

My sister was in a similar situation a couple of years ago, when she was working as a pharmacy assistant in a large drugstore chain. The pharmacist was passing her responsibilty that buy law, she shouldn't have, making decisions regarding medication that could damage the health of patients. (In order to sit in the office on his bum, doing sweet FA) When she complained that she wasn't happy to carry on that way, he threatened to have her fired if she complained. She eventually worked up the courage to report him, and he lost his job, though he wasnt very pleasant afterward, my sister felt her conscience was clear!

 

[smooth]

There are different topics of law and it is a criminal offence to break the type of law that this person is currently breaking, the evidence is from them in writing and signed believe it or not with their working address.

What has been really interesting (and I do mean interesting and not judging anyone) is how some geeks would report some offences but not others, are we a society where we will turn our backs on some things but not others? Is it to do with social interaction, self preservation or just not wanting to get involved? Or are we only willing to report things that directly affect or could affect our family, friends or business? This could be a poll couldn't it?

In this case, there are a couple of practitioners with evidence but they won't say anything in light of any comeback from this individual, to say they are the lowest of the low is an understatement! x

 

[jacquelineanna]

With regard to your 'poll' question there are people who are very 'black and white' and would dob you in for picking an apple from a back garden that is not your own. There are others who like you said just don't won't to get involved regardless of the either indiscretion or crime. And then there are a big bunch of people in the middle of which I am one. We weigh up the moral situation according to our own values and make decisions based on that. As I already said an illegal apple picker or sweeper-up I would not have the heart to report. The person you are talking about I would report. The person stealing baby milk I would turn a blind eye to. The one trying to steal a trolley full of alcohol I would report. Stealing from the 'common man or woman' is not acceptable. Stealing from a big corporation, I would shrug my shoulders. As we go throughout our day to day lives we are making teeny weeny moral judgements all the time without even realising it.

For other readers of this post - please give your own opinions, it will be interesting, but please don't disrespect or attack mine. Thank you.

Jacqui xx

 

[Miss Pink23]

Personally if I knew that peoples lives were in danger and potential problems could arise if they continue to trade in they way they do, I would definitely report them.
To say that they need to earn money to feed and clothe their children is besides the point. You don't need to trade illegally or cut corners (especially when medicinal doses are involved) to make money. They are taking dangerous risks and I would report them straight away. If they have already been visited by the authorities its obviously not something extremely dangerous, but they may be the kind of people that instead of being spooked by being visited once they look upon it as 'yes we've escaped the law, so lets carry only and take more chances'. Peoples health and safety is of the utmost importance. They are trusting them to administer the correct dose (or whatever it is) and they are being abused and their human rights are being violated. Dont despair, call right away IMO.

 

[silverbird9t9]

If these people have already been warned by the authorities and still continue, they deserve all they get.

Smooth you strike me as a person who takes their role as a qualified health care professional seriously and this is clearly worrying you. By reporting it now you may prevent injury to a trusting client. You know you would feel awful if you turned a blind eye and someone was injured by them. If you have the support of others to make a joint complaint I feel you may get better results.

It's a tough call, good luck.

 

[Simba44]

With regard to your 'poll' question there are people who are very 'black and white' and would dob you in for picking an apple from a back garden that is not your own. There are others who like you said just don't won't to get involved regardless of the either indiscretion or crime. And then there are a big bunch of people in the middle of which I am one. We weigh up the moral situation according to our own values and make decisions based on that. As I already said an illegal apple picker or sweeper-up I would not have the heart to report. The person you are talking about I would report. The person stealing baby milk I would turn a blind eye to. The one trying to steal a trolley full of alcohol I would report. Stealing from the 'common man or woman' is not acceptable. Stealing from a big corporation, I would shrug my shoulders. As we go throughout our day to day lives we are making teeny weeny moral judgements all the time without even realising it.

For other readers of this post - please give your own opinions, it will be interesting, but please don't disrespect or attack mine. Thank you.

Jacqui xx

Exactly right, if I found that somebody was administering a medicine ie Botox I would report them due to the fact that they were not qualified as a nurse, doctor or dentist for the fact it can cause permanent disfigurement and therefore would be serious enough. But I couldn't if someone stole baby milk or had to do something desperate to feed her children. Many cases go to court under survival rights that if a single parent gets caught failing to declare to DWP his or her earnings very few if any go to prison claiming they had to feed and clothe children. I'd rather they pay the money back if caught. There was a case last year of a single parent working whilst claiming and failed to declare £210 and this did go to court and she was name and shamed and it cost the tax payer £9000 for the privileged to take her to court. Do we see all the politicians going to prison over fraudulent expenses and for this reason I wouldn't snitch.

 

[tigi]

I would report them. I think that I would look at this way, they are doing something that could potentially risk and injury to someone. If that is the case then could i sleep at night knowing what i know? no I couldnt . so yes I would report them.

 

[smooth]

I'm sure no-one will attack anyone on here for personal opinions concerning who you would report. Everyone has their own opinion but it seems for this situation the general point of view is they should be reported. The first time they were stopped with a warning, so this time I am sure it would be something more severe.

 

[magentahair]

Hey smooth, I dont really know why this is up for debate? I'd report anyone who was putting the public at risk and wouldnt care about any comeback on me!!! We all train far too long and spend far too much money on courses etc to make sure we have all the right relevent quals. someone working illegally makes me angry especially if they are not following regs etc! I think individual reports are better then one group one then u can report to different bodies! I honestly wouldnt hesitate! :green:

 

[jacquelineanna]

Yes reporting them is the almost unanimous response.

Sadly I have seen many threads on this site where people have posted their opinions in response to a question only to be bullied by others with more agressive styles. Its ugly and unnecessary. Respect not disrespect.

Hope your situation has a positive outcome.

Jacqui xx

 

[smooth]

Absolutely agree with you all with regards to this person needing reporting, as they have slipped back into flouting the law habitually I wonder what will have to happen to them to sit up and actually take notice?

 

[Lorrainelola]

Breaking the law is breaking the law. I wouldn't hesitate to contact Police or appropriate authority regarding someone doing something illegal.

My hubby is a police officer, I couldn't turn a blind eye at anything I saw or knew was happening. If i saw somebody stealing I would report them, if I knew someone was evading tax payments I would report them If I knew someone wasn't insured to carry out treatments I would report them.

Why should I pay taxes, NI and live a lawful life and end up paying for those who thieve or don't pay taxes or get benefits which they aren't entitled to.

I don't think I'm a harsh person I've worked all my life albeit 5 years off when my soon was born. If I don't have the money for something i go without. Its blooming hard work getting a business off the ground and with my bad health problems lately I've not worked for nearly 8 weeks so no money coming in from me.