Wages Problems - Greedy Owners

[pinkaholic]

The owners own debts should surely have no effect on the employees pay. These debts and risks taken were a choice.

well by this statement its obvious your not a salon owner. the debts are not caused by excess shopping or business lunches! but by britsh gas, united utilities and performing rights society!! £80 quid per year to play the radio!! rates and council tax, overheads the change in mortgae rates extra taxes by companies house Ltd company taxes, all of which must be paid or there would be redunanceys!! at thee end of the day the CHOICE you mention could be just to pack it all in and make her 6 staff jobless. no one works harder for their business than the salon owner herself!! staff are paid PAYE (well mine are, the majority of the people on this site i have noticed are'nt) which means, perks= holiday pay, matirinity pay, sick pay, working tax credit and a wage in the bank every month on time regardless if there has only been one client through the door all month!! a salon owner gets... none of the above!! a quiet month means no wages and if your sick you come in regardless and if your in hospital, tough! no pay and loss of takings. welcome to my world. i love my job, but good job i do because no one else would work for that.

 

[pazzy]

I have been an employee and employer and have heard both sides and agree with both sides.

I have been there when the wages and bills paid out were far more than the income the salon took. Its a horrible feeling paying someone who has literally sat and read magazines. I suggested that she went self employed - but obviously she refused.

I am not blaming her but I did say that if she actively tried to increase the salons revenue then I would give her more money. I must remind everyone here that - I took the bare minimum from the salon for food occasionally and I am just paying off debts from the salon now (3 years later). I decided to close the salon and go on my own (mobile) and havent looked back. I can sleep at night not worrying how I can pay everything.

I think I was to blame here though - I wasnt a very good business woman (I had been treat badly as an employee myself) and was determined to make an employee be treated the way i would have loved to have been...big mistake!!

If my employee was working to full capacity and generating new business too - there would have been great rewards for her.

A monthly meeting and target setting is the way that the business can move on.

Give the therapist a role, a target to meet and when achieved reward them...isnt that how we would all like to be appreciated.

I have no intentions of ever being an employer again BUT if I did, I would do things differently. Your staff is your business and the business is the staffs source of income. Worked out properly - the 2 can come together and make the business grow.

 

[pinkthistle]

My first experience of being a good employer where i gave 'perks' and higher wages from day one left me fighting an unfair dismissal claim after my salon was cleared overnight of stock for the new salon opening down the road!! She was never dismissed, just couldnt work two places at once...long story. Anyway ive seen it both sides as a hairdresser i asked for more money and was presented a family credit form to fill in!!

And as an employer taken to the cleaners by a lying, cheating employee who was given a company car, stock at cost, free treatments to friends and family, as many seminars and training costs as she wanted including the paid time off to attend them, 4 weeks holiday a year plus bank holidays or paid double time, I valued her as a member of staff keeping my clients happy and wanted to keep her, simple.

Ended up costing me thousands to fight her in court, not to mention the stock, almost cost me my business and my marriage while she got grants and benefits galore to start up...and the biggest laugh, all her new staff were day release from college so unpaid. The ones she poached from me didnt last long.

Luckily i won the case but learnt my lesson not to be too good an employer or too trusting of people. Oh and its amazing the stories from clients i thought loved her that were glad to see the back of her! Incidentally she had a union rep backing her who believed her lies over me, the big bad boss!

At the end of the day its a badly paid industry, we know that before we start training. I was told i was overqualified when i left school, why did i want to throw away my education to be a hairdresser or beauty therapist...my choice. I then had the choice to accept or decline terms and conditions from empolyers as we all do, some good some bad. I then had the choice how to treat my staff, all but one turned out good and 10 years down the line all my staff have stayed on.

 

[minky]

Reading this thread makes me wonder why more techs don't start a co-op. This is where for example, you would all split the rent and bills of a salon and then work for yourself, keeping any money that you make.

Excellent Idea this Co op
sounds like a really great Idea I would be interested in finding out some more about how this all works, and as you say after expenses ect you take home your own pay that you have earned ,
if this worked out it would be really good, anyone know anything about it ? we could start a new thread

 

[bombini]

I think every salon is different, some salons that pay minimum wage invest heavily in training, some salons pay a reasonable wage but offer hardly any training, some salons pay excellent rates and offer execellent training, etc, etc,

Four years ago I was working for £5.90 per hour in a spa, two late nights a week and practically every weekend but I was sent on lots of training with some fab ranges and extra courses like hot stone massage. At the time I just kept thinking £5.90 (£12,000 pa) was peanuts but now I see how much those courses, accomodation, travel expenses and wages paid to me when i was training really cost.

I don't think the industry is that well paid but salon owners have to take such a gamble when they take staff on to make sure they don't train them up and then wave goodbye 6 months later with their money !

btw, im not a salon owner !

 

[Sassy Hassy]

OKay forgive me first of all as I haven't read every post in this thread, but I kind of get the gist of it as I have quickly flitted through each one.

I think Weegirl has been very eloquent in her posting and has not tarred all salons with the same brush, just merely pointing out to those that do not value their staff that they really should do. For any salon owners that have taken offence then i guess you are the good guys and shoud be proud that you take your responsibilites as an employer seriously and shouldn't take to heart comments that aren't aimed at you.

However money isn't always the key factor in ANY employment. I was in a HIGHLY paid job before I got into nails, I never had to check my bank balance as I knew the money was there and yet I hated where I worked as I didn't feel valued as an employee or a human being.

So getting the balance right is crucial and making a member of staff in any job feel valued and motivated is sooo important. I do however agree that the average therapists salary is pretty well below par ... it's one of the reasons I chose to go self employed ... although that isn't as kushty or as easy as we all think ... suddenly all those overheads and empty spaces in the appointment book are MINE !!!!

Great topic for debate, have to say I nearly missed this one!

 

[-sophisticutz-]

There are so many good points here from both sides of the equation. For me, the poor money side has never been an issue for, I love my job and did not go into for the wages although they help. Hair/beauty/nails has always been a badly paid profession (also underated as professions) but that never put me of I would never trade my job satisfaction for money, but thats just me Although I agree its not right wages are poor but I still thanked God for min. wage as only 10 years ago I remember being on £2.60 hr

Now I have my own salon I really am no better off, I invest heavily back into my salon and staff training/wages/commission and although I dont pay a massive wage (although I pay above nat. min.) I pay what I can afford and I like to think I treat all my team well. Above all they all get a thankyou every week for their hard work and I save my tips and take them out on nights out. For me and I can speak for my staff also (they tell me enough) It about be appriciated for what they do and they wages are a bonus for doing what they love.

My what a can of worms this is

 

[weezie]

well by this statement its obvious your not a salon owner. the debts are not caused by excess shopping or business lunches! but by britsh gas, united utilities and performing rights society!! £80 quid per year to play the radio!! rates and council tax, overheads the change in mortgae rates extra taxes by companies house Ltd company taxes, all of which must be paid or there would be redunanceys!! at thee end of the day the CHOICE you mention could be just to pack it all in and make her 6 staff jobless. no one works harder for their business than the salon owner herself!! staff are paid PAYE (well mine are, the majority of the people on this site i have noticed are'nt) which means, perks= holiday pay, matirinity pay, sick pay, working tax credit and a wage in the bank every month on time regardless if there has only been one client through the door all month!! a salon owner gets... none of the above!! a quiet month means no wages and if your sick you come in regardless and if your in hospital, tough! no pay and loss of takings. welcome to my world. i love my job, but good job i do because no one else would work for that.

You are quite right, I run my own mobile business rather than open a salon because I know all about these rates and charges. I neither get sick pay but I am insured wages because of how I have built up my business. This is what a business plan is about, assessing the risks and then making the choice about whether you choose to take them on. You then profit from the benefits or loose out due to the risk. No one makes the decision to open the salon but you. It is very sad when a salon is not doing well but the staff should surely expect to be paid and not be grateful that the owner has paid them even if the salon is making a loss. Just as salon owners really deserve to reap the benefits if the salon does well, as it is down to them, their decisions, their hard work and their business sense. :hug:

 

[Ruby19]

Wow,

What a post and great debate.

I used to work in a salon many years ago but left becuase of the poor working environment and low wage (even though I was an assistant manager). I spent a few years out of the industry, although I carried on with training in various fields e.g. reflexology, aromatherapy etc. and reached a position in a career in mental health where my salary was fairly good. However, it got to a point where I dreaded going to work and so decided to have a go at setting up my own salon.

The set up and running costs have been fairly high, although not what I expected. I work on my own in the salon and probably put in 60 - 70 hours per week. I have only been going for 8 months and I am just about in a position where I can start to pay myself a small wage.

I can not afford to take anyone on just yet although I hope to in the near future as the business develops. I am taking on a modern apprentice and hope to mould her in the ways in which I have been.

I see that when I am in a position to be able to take someone on that I will be fair and reasonable with them and look to provide them with a package that makes them feel they can stay within the industry and not leave as I did.

It is the same in any field in any industry in that if you have a good employee you should reward them accordingly. Give them a fair salary and good working environment - it shouldn't all be about the money.

I think minimum wage is a good starting point and then increased depending upon experience, value to the business, etc. I wouldn't want to pay someone above minimum wage that wasn't willing to put the effort in to help make my business a success. As my business succeeds then so will the rewards for those who help it become successful.

I will assess the input the employee has in my business and reward them accordingly whether this is through salary, benefits, bonuses, enjoyment etc. but hopefully a mix of everything.

I got back in to this industry to have a job that I looked forward to and didn't begrudge getting up for everyday. I don't plan to make millions but if a little extra comes along the way then I won't moan either!

Everybody should have a similar attitude and if you look after your employees as I intend to do then I am sure you will reap the rewards two fold.

Good luck to everyone, employers and employees and remember this is a fantastic industry because we make it that way.

Karen
xx

 

[pinkaholic]

good call!!

 

[clare04]

Please do not tar everyone with the same brush.

I am a salon owner and have been for 2 years, I went from being Salon Manager with a reasonable wage to someone who is lucky if I get £150 a month. I relay on my partners wage to live.

I wish i could pay my staff more than I do but at the moment it is not possible although they do get commission on top of their wages.

You may think that all salon owners are well off but often things are not what they seem to be.

 

[BABSann]

I have to say that if an employer cannot pay any more or much more than minimum wage because she cannot afford it, that she looks very much at other ways to keep her staff(only if these particular staff are good,hard workers of course.

For example, it's been mentioned that some wouldn't want to pay someone that wasn't pulling their weight,and quite rightly too.But,what about all the therapists that do work damned hard,cover their boss's holidays,stay back after work to do that desperate client,have a full column practically every day, not to mention many other things that give the salon an excellent reputation and tbqh should be earning a damned sight more than minimum wage?Can the owners really claim that they cannot pay more???

Firstly if this is the case then it's crucial that you MAKE sure you pay more than minimum wage.I know a lot of salons can be quiet but unfortunately there are some owners that take the mick,they claim that they cant pay anymore than minimum wage yet quite obviuosly they can,I have seen this first hand but wont go into details.

I'm not saying all owners are the same but in my opinion,if you want to keep that SPECIAL therapist,who treats the salon as she would her own,then show her you appreciate her,pay her what you can because if you dont she will leave and then where will that leave you?With a college leaver or someone who quite happily accepts min wage or less,who dosn't give a damn,has no people skills,no experience and who the clients will not want to come to.

Anyway,if a salon owner is worried about paying more than minimum wage for a therapist who doesn't pull her weight then give her commission on treatments and sales,I doubt you will have a lazy therapist for very much longer and lets face it the more she/he works the more you can afford to pay.

By the way,I am not saying for 1 minute that all salon owners are the same as I know this isn't the case,this is my point of view from experience of working in this industry for some years.Unfortuanely most of us are not just in the job for the job,much as I love my job and my clients I have a mortgage and family,money very much DOES come into it and I would be long gone from any salon that paid me minimum wage,why???because I am worth a damned site more and always give 100%.

 

[Nicifer_noonoo]

Get educated, get paid more. Simple.

Why the hell should a young girl without qualifications get the same wage as someone who has spent several years studying towards a qualification?

If only things were this simple! I have 5 A levels, an NVQ, numerous certificates from training courses undertaken privately, and I am in the process of gaining a degree. But still no salon owner would pay me more than £6 per hour. Such is life in this industry!

 

[CadenceAlex]

If only things were this simple! I have 5 A levels, an NVQ, numerous certificates from training courses undertaken privately, and I am in the process of gaining a degree. But still no salon owner would pay me more than £6 per hour. Such is life in this industry!

A Levels and a Degree don't tell a Salon Owner you are better in the Beauty Industry than anyone else.

My plasterer (excellent plasterer) has a Degree in Graphic designing. Should I pay him more than another plasterer who left school without GCSE's?!

 

[Nicifer_noonoo]

A Levels and a Degree don't tell a Salon Owner you are better in the Beauty Industry than anyone else.

My plasterer (excellent plasterer) has a Degree in Graphic designing. Should I pay him more than another plasterer who left school without GCSE's?!

You're absolutely right, the degree and A levels don't show that I'm better than anyone else. So why are most salons asking for NVQ 3, if education doesn't show that I'm better than anyone else? I worked my butt off for a year just to get an interview, all because I didn't want to go back to college full time for the fourth time to do NVQ3. Never mind the degree in Complementary Therapy :biggrin:

Fortunately, I did get the chance to tell a Salon Owner I'm 'better in the Beauty Industry than anyone else', with a trade test, CV and explanation why I left LSE to follow my heart!

 

[oey]

You're absolutely right, the degree and A levels don't show that I'm better than anyone else. So why are most salons asking for NVQ 3, if education doesn't show that I'm better than anyone else? I worked my butt off for a year just to get an interview, all because I didn't want to go back to college full time for the fourth time to do NVQ3. Never mind the degree in Complementary Therapy :biggrin:

Fortunately, I did get the chance to tell a Salon Owner I'm 'better in the Beauty Industry than anyone else', with a trade test, CV and explanation why I left LSE to follow my heart!

In a specific industry qualification it is different than general education qualifications. An NVQ3 is an indication of the treatments that you are trained to carry out, whihch in a treatment situation is important.

A trade test shows how good you are at the treatment, but without the NVQ3 training or equivalent you cannot carry out that treatment.

 

[Nicifer_noonoo]

In a specific industry qualification it is different than general education qualifications. An NVQ3 is an indication of the treatments that you are trained to carry out, whihch in a treatment situation is important.

A trade test shows how good you are at the treatment, but without the NVQ3 training or equivalent you cannot carry out that treatment.

I know this, it was just so frustrating for Salons to be demanding NVQ 3 and X years experience to carry out treatments I'm already qualified and proficient in. I am in no way disputing NVQ3 as a valuable qualification, and didn't mean to offend anyone who's studied hard to gain them. It just wasn't the best option for me, I had no interest in the course matter and wanted to go down a more holistic route...which unfortunately, they didn't do as an NVQ 3!

My apologies if I've offended anyone :hug:

 

[oey]

I know this, it was just so frustrating for Salons to be demanding NVQ 3 and X years experience to carry out treatments I'm already qualified and proficient in. I am in no way disputing NVQ3 as a valuable qualification, and didn't mean to offend anyone who's studied hard to gain them. It just wasn't the best option for me, I had no interest in the course matter and wanted to go down a more holistic route...which unfortunately, they didn't do as an NVQ 3!

My apologies if I've offended anyone :hug:

If you dont mind me asking what route did you go down for your holistic therapy qualifications? And what treatments are including in your "holistic" treatments.

 

[Nicifer_noonoo]

If you dont mind me asking what route did you go down for your holistic therapy qualifications? And what treatments are including in your "holistic" treatments.

Not at all :green:
The treatments I'm currently employed to offer are ones I qualified in on NVQ 2 or have since attended a private course to qualify in: manis/pedis, facials, waxing, eye treatments, make up, swedish massage, manual tanning.

The treatments I am NOT qualified in just yet (and therefore not practising), but am currently studying to be able to offer are aromatherapy, reflexology, and homeopathy.

 

[oey]

Not at all :green:
The treatments I'm currently employed to offer are ones I qualified in on NVQ 2 or have since attended a private course to qualify in: manis/pedis, facials, waxing, eye treatments, make up, swedish massage, manual tanning.

The treatments I am NOT qualified in just yet (and therefore not practising), but am currently studying to be able to offer are aromatherapy, reflexology, and homeopathy.

Thanks for the info.

Some employers do say that they will accept NVQ3 or equivalent so with the additional treatments you are studying for it could be sufficient for quite a number of employers. There are a few additional qualifications that NVQ would bring (i.e. electrical treatments, indian head etc) that you wont have so I would imagine these treatments are popular in the salon where you are unable to find work. If the clients come to the salon for one of those treatments that you wont be trained in then the employer is more like to employ somebody that does have the qauifications in treatments that the clients come to the salon for.