meggylou
Active Member
I've been trying to find someone to do my semi permanent brows, is there anyone near Staffordshire and if so could you message me with details and prices 
thanks
thanks
Semi permanent make-up
- Thread starter Elux
- Start date
Help Support SalonGeek:
Great post! I can see that there is a lot of confusion over prices, training, equipment etc, so hopefully our new website might be able to help clear up some of the questions in this thread.
We are very excited to let you know about our new website - Micropigmentation Pro is a new Online Magazine specifically made for Permanent Makeup Artists and will feature -
- Interviews with top industry professionals
- Tips and tricks on how to effectively market your business
- Equipment comparisons & reviews
- Exclusive Micropigmentation Pro member offers
- And much, much more!
Please visit www.micropigmentationpro.com to sign up for Early Access and also a chance to win a 1 year Premium Membership!
We'll be covering a lot of the issues raised in this thread and hopefully you all find it a useful resource
We are very excited to let you know about our new website - Micropigmentation Pro is a new Online Magazine specifically made for Permanent Makeup Artists and will feature -
- Interviews with top industry professionals
- Tips and tricks on how to effectively market your business
- Equipment comparisons & reviews
- Exclusive Micropigmentation Pro member offers
- And much, much more!
Please visit www.micropigmentationpro.com to sign up for Early Access and also a chance to win a 1 year Premium Membership!
We'll be covering a lot of the issues raised in this thread and hopefully you all find it a useful resource
Last edited:
nessa111
New Member
hi kerryanne I trained with Dermace too and my sister in law they are brilliant, I am insured by holistics with them they are £180 a year but my sister in law who also trained with them went with beeches which is about what your paying but she also trained in rejuvi, mca and medical tattooing this covers all so I dont think its bad at all x
Katy Jobbins
New Member
Just thought I would reply to your question about Semi-Permanent Makeup Training.
My name is Katy Jobbins, I am a trainer in permanent makeup myself & I run the multi award winning 'Permanent Makeup Training Academy' in Sussex.
I've written report entitled '12 Things You MUST Know Before You Invest in Permanent Makeup Training that I think might be useful to you.
I will briefly summarise it below to hopefully help you find the right trainer for you:
1. Make sure you research ALL companies AND TRAINERS that you are considering training with.
It pays dividends to do a bit of research into not only the company you are thinking of completing your training with, but also, even more importantly, who they themselves will be using as your potential trainer.
There are lots of companies & individuals offering permanent makeup training & their prices widely vary. I have known people use reputable companies only to come out of their training with literally no confidence in permanent makeup procedures, yet having spent tens of thousands of pounds. They have all the equipment (& also a lot that they do not need & will never use), but feel like they simply did not connect with the person or people training them.
2. Choose a trainer who specialises in EXACTLY what you want to learn
If the company you are looking to train with has multiple trainers around the country, you will need to find out if they train in exactly the same way. Many technicians have completely different styles of working and teaching so you will need to research the background of the trainer that they are going to use for your course. This will enable you to see if their main skillset matches what you are looking to achieve.
Ask if you can have a look at their individual portfolios and career history. Remember, as impressive as it sounds that they are the "Top Harley Street areola reconstruction specialist", if all you want to do is offer beautiful eyebrows, eyeliner & lips in your local area then this trainer may not be suitable to you and your individual needs.
3. Does the person/people who will be training you, run their own successful permanent makeup practice of their own?
In my view, its absolutely essential that your trainer also runs their own business for them to really understand the work of a permanent makeup technician.
When I say they need to run their own business, I dont mean they also offer haircuts, facials, sets of nails, waxing and eyelash extensions etc., because generally this type of trainer is not a permanent makeup expert but really someone who dabbles in and out of lots of different treatments.
Ideally you want to spend your money learning from someone who is running their own permanent makeup business, who is dealing with real clients day in day out. It doesn't matter if they work for a big company, as long as they deal & satisfy their own permanent makeup clients on a daily basis.
After all, thats what you want to be doing soon isnt it?
4. ARE YOU TIED IN FOR LIFE on your equipment, pigments, needles etc. & what will be your on-going re-stocking costs?
This is a very common problem we find many students find themselves caught in. Once you have trained with a particular company you need to find out whether or not you are free to chop and change your pigments, needles and machinery etc.
The problem that a lot of training companies give their students it that because they make a lot of on-going revenue from selling you more pigments & needles etc. they will tell you that should you go elsewhere or change from using their pigments etc. this will in-validate your insurance!!!
A freelance trainer, however, can recommend the best on the market, train you in multiple products and find a machine that is right for you at the right budget without being bias.
What is also vitally important to find out before you decide to train with a particular company is the cost of re-stocking the products you need to perform your treatments.
The worst thing that can happen is... that you dont do your research & you end up training with a firm that you are committed to for life, who charge £40+ per pigment.
One of the reasons that I set up The Permanent Makeup Training Academy was to do so in such a way that totally eliminates this kind of problem that exists in the industry.
Once students have trained with me, we do not sell pigments & needles etc. What we do is simply tell you where you can buy them wholesale, saving you anything from 25% to up to 80% of your on-going costs.
5. Can you see or speak to anyone who has completed the training or at least watch real live student video testimonials?
Look for testimonials on training companies websites. Anyone could write a testimonial, but the most up to date companies should now be providing video testimonials online for any potential future technicians to look at.
The more up-to-date their website is, will give you an idea of how up to date the training will be. If they have not put a testimonial up for over 2 years then this may indicate how up to date and successful their training is.
It would also be advisable to see if they have their own YouTube channel, as nowadays most top training companies should have lots and lots of recent student video testimonials that you can browse through at your own convenience.
You can see ours at: https://www.youtube.com/permanentmakeupuk
6. Are you training 1 on 1 or in a group of students?
Classes need to be kept as small as possible, as the learning is very intense and you will need a lot of individual attention throughout the days you train. When looking at the amount of days training you get for your money you need to take into account the quality of those days training.
You could have 4 or 5 days training with a head trainer on a bespoke one-to-one training course, or 8 days training with 7 people in the same class, being taught by someone who doesnt even have their own permanent makeup practice!
It goes without saying, that if you can get 1 on 1 training for your very first course, then this hugely outweighs any group training you may receive. Group training can be very good in a workshop format, but I find only when you already know the skill of permanent makeup. Remember, you are paying good money to learn this skill & set up your new career...the last thing you want is to get lost in a group of 3 or 4 others & be unable to ask all the questions you need to in order to become confident in learning your new skill of permanent makeup.
7. Find out the TRUE cost of permanent make up training - & find out if your course fee also includes your first years treatment & public liability insurance, start-up kit etc.
Most good training companies will include the first years free insurance otherwise that could be one more thing you will have to pay for as well as equipment and local licencing fees.
8. How much does your trainer charge for their treatments?
Now to me, this is one of the most important things you need to find out. Is the person you are going to be training with charging higher or lower than the industry standard?
They should be charging more than the average permanent makeup technician, because 9 times out of ten, price reflects education.
*****************************************
The price your trainer charges strongly co-relates to the price that your clients will be willing to pay you after you have trained with them i.e. if your trainer can only charge between £200 and £300 per treatment and they have been doing it years then what does that mean you can charge once you have been trained by them?
*****************************************
9. How easy is it to train with them, i.e. will your training experience be simple to complete.
I know this sounds an odd question, but you wouldn't believe the horror stories we hear from students coming to us for re-training & confidence boosting. Examples like having to bring all their own models for treatments, even if the training course is hundreds of miles away, needing to sort out their own treatment insurance & not being allowed to ever use any other products or services other than theirs the list goes on.
The little things really do count . Will they pick you up from your hotel each day if you dont drive. Do they recommend local hotels or B & Bs where previous students have stayed. Will they provide models for you for your initial training to save you the hassle of getting 4 - 6 friends and family members to come with you to your training course (surely you prefer to save them for your own models and case studies before your assessment day).
All I am trying to do here is make you aware that if you have to jump through hoops & meet lots of terms and conditions before you even get accepted onto the course or in order to complete the course, then you have to question how over-complicated their training may be as well.
10. Does the company care about you & your needs?
What I mean here is, do you get the feeling, you know, the gut feeling, that the company you are speaking to really care about you or are they only interested in selling their courses?
At The Permanent Makeup Training Academy, we know that every single student of ours can be training with us for different reasons. You might be starting a whole new career in the industry, you may wish to add a high end treatment to your existing beauty skills, you may be a new mum looking to start work again but want to work part time hours whilst earning a full time wage, you may be a salon owner looking to delegate the lower end treatments to staff & only concentrate on the high profit margin treatments like permanent makeup, you may want to add another £10,000 - £20,000 to your income by working an extra day or 2 a week or wanting to make £100,000 + and concentrate on it full time & so on ..
It is because of this that we tailor each training course to the individual taking it. This is not something that can be done if you are training in a group environment as you are all generally taught the same things no matter what your individual goals, dreams & aspirations are.
When speaking to the company you are thinking of training with you need to decide on whether or not you think they are they easily approachable. Why? Because there will be times after your initial training where you will need to speak to someone, probably the person who trained you, so do you get the feeling that they are friendly, welcoming and helpful to speak and deal with.
If not, I would advise considering trying a different training company. One that puts your needs and individual circumstances first.
11. What on-going support & future training courses does your permanent makeup training company offer you?
Although this should really go without saying, youd be amazed at how hard it can be to get hold of the person that trained you for a quick question as you have a client waiting on your beauty couch for their permanent makeup treatment.
Try and find a company that you have access to as often as you feel you may need it. Many companies say they offer 24 or 12 hours a day support to their students, but make sure that this is not just via email i.e., make sure you have a hotline number you can call in for essential need to know now questions. The last thing you need when you have a quick question that can be answered in a matter of seconds if you can get hold of the right person, is to wait 3 days for an email reply!
Also it is worth finding out what advanced permanent makeup training courses the company you are thinking about training with for your initial training can offer you. Training can be very addictive, so once you have mastered the initial skill of permanent makeup, it will only be natural that you want to improve and enhance those skills at a later date. Make sure the company you train with has potential to help you grow in your new career.
12. What help can your training company offer you in terms of the business & marketing side of permanent makeup?
The great thing about choosing a career in permanent makeup is that it is a relatively low cost business to start up. Once you have completed your initial training & got your machine & start up kit, the only real cost you will have (unless you intend to set up a high street clinic etc.) is to learn how to market your services.
There are so many low cost options that you can take advantage of to keep your costs low, such as working from home, mobile or renting rooms in beauty salons by the hour etc., that initially, you really shouldnt need to spend an awful lot more than your original training cost to get going.
The difference between you and your local permanent makeup competitors (if you have any in your area), is only really down to one thing. Your business skills & your marketing skills.
Marketing & learning how to market your permanent makeup skills is an essential must, to anyone serious about making some real money and a truly rewarding career out of this skill. Anyone can plod along doing 1 or 2 clients a week charging £200 - £300 per client once they have mastered the skill of permanent makeup.
However, the difference between doing that and having clients queuing up to use you when you are charging double or even triple those prices is simply down to how your market yourself and your permanent makeup services.
I always believe that if you are going to do something, then you may as well do it properly. This is why we are the only company that runs dedicated 3 day business & marketing courses for permanent makeup technicians on an invite only basis.
Only when you have mastered this skill are you ready to really market your services properly. Whats the point of getting hundreds of clients from day 1, if you cant do an amazing job for them?
You will only be selling yourself short & end up disappointing what might have been raving fans of your permanent makeup business in the future by doing them to soon.
One Final Bit of Advice
When researching to find the best possible training, remember, it is very personal to yourself, so one last tip would be to have a look at their website and the language they use.
Is it friendly and easy to understand or do you have to be a genius to work out what it means?
I hope that this helps you and anyone else reading this thread.
If you have any other questions or would like to pick my brains about helping you start your career in permanent makeup please feel free to call my office on 01444 300157 at any time.
I also have over 180 student video reviews on my YouTube Channel at permanentmakeupuk - YouTube
Good Luck with whoever you choose to train with.
Katy x
My name is Katy Jobbins, I am a trainer in permanent makeup myself & I run the multi award winning 'Permanent Makeup Training Academy' in Sussex.
I've written report entitled '12 Things You MUST Know Before You Invest in Permanent Makeup Training that I think might be useful to you.
I will briefly summarise it below to hopefully help you find the right trainer for you:
1. Make sure you research ALL companies AND TRAINERS that you are considering training with.
It pays dividends to do a bit of research into not only the company you are thinking of completing your training with, but also, even more importantly, who they themselves will be using as your potential trainer.
There are lots of companies & individuals offering permanent makeup training & their prices widely vary. I have known people use reputable companies only to come out of their training with literally no confidence in permanent makeup procedures, yet having spent tens of thousands of pounds. They have all the equipment (& also a lot that they do not need & will never use), but feel like they simply did not connect with the person or people training them.
2. Choose a trainer who specialises in EXACTLY what you want to learn
If the company you are looking to train with has multiple trainers around the country, you will need to find out if they train in exactly the same way. Many technicians have completely different styles of working and teaching so you will need to research the background of the trainer that they are going to use for your course. This will enable you to see if their main skillset matches what you are looking to achieve.
Ask if you can have a look at their individual portfolios and career history. Remember, as impressive as it sounds that they are the "Top Harley Street areola reconstruction specialist", if all you want to do is offer beautiful eyebrows, eyeliner & lips in your local area then this trainer may not be suitable to you and your individual needs.
3. Does the person/people who will be training you, run their own successful permanent makeup practice of their own?
In my view, its absolutely essential that your trainer also runs their own business for them to really understand the work of a permanent makeup technician.
When I say they need to run their own business, I dont mean they also offer haircuts, facials, sets of nails, waxing and eyelash extensions etc., because generally this type of trainer is not a permanent makeup expert but really someone who dabbles in and out of lots of different treatments.
Ideally you want to spend your money learning from someone who is running their own permanent makeup business, who is dealing with real clients day in day out. It doesn't matter if they work for a big company, as long as they deal & satisfy their own permanent makeup clients on a daily basis.
After all, thats what you want to be doing soon isnt it?
4. ARE YOU TIED IN FOR LIFE on your equipment, pigments, needles etc. & what will be your on-going re-stocking costs?
This is a very common problem we find many students find themselves caught in. Once you have trained with a particular company you need to find out whether or not you are free to chop and change your pigments, needles and machinery etc.
The problem that a lot of training companies give their students it that because they make a lot of on-going revenue from selling you more pigments & needles etc. they will tell you that should you go elsewhere or change from using their pigments etc. this will in-validate your insurance!!!
A freelance trainer, however, can recommend the best on the market, train you in multiple products and find a machine that is right for you at the right budget without being bias.
What is also vitally important to find out before you decide to train with a particular company is the cost of re-stocking the products you need to perform your treatments.
The worst thing that can happen is... that you dont do your research & you end up training with a firm that you are committed to for life, who charge £40+ per pigment.
One of the reasons that I set up The Permanent Makeup Training Academy was to do so in such a way that totally eliminates this kind of problem that exists in the industry.
Once students have trained with me, we do not sell pigments & needles etc. What we do is simply tell you where you can buy them wholesale, saving you anything from 25% to up to 80% of your on-going costs.
5. Can you see or speak to anyone who has completed the training or at least watch real live student video testimonials?
Look for testimonials on training companies websites. Anyone could write a testimonial, but the most up to date companies should now be providing video testimonials online for any potential future technicians to look at.
The more up-to-date their website is, will give you an idea of how up to date the training will be. If they have not put a testimonial up for over 2 years then this may indicate how up to date and successful their training is.
It would also be advisable to see if they have their own YouTube channel, as nowadays most top training companies should have lots and lots of recent student video testimonials that you can browse through at your own convenience.
You can see ours at: https://www.youtube.com/permanentmakeupuk
6. Are you training 1 on 1 or in a group of students?
Classes need to be kept as small as possible, as the learning is very intense and you will need a lot of individual attention throughout the days you train. When looking at the amount of days training you get for your money you need to take into account the quality of those days training.
You could have 4 or 5 days training with a head trainer on a bespoke one-to-one training course, or 8 days training with 7 people in the same class, being taught by someone who doesnt even have their own permanent makeup practice!
It goes without saying, that if you can get 1 on 1 training for your very first course, then this hugely outweighs any group training you may receive. Group training can be very good in a workshop format, but I find only when you already know the skill of permanent makeup. Remember, you are paying good money to learn this skill & set up your new career...the last thing you want is to get lost in a group of 3 or 4 others & be unable to ask all the questions you need to in order to become confident in learning your new skill of permanent makeup.
7. Find out the TRUE cost of permanent make up training - & find out if your course fee also includes your first years treatment & public liability insurance, start-up kit etc.
Most good training companies will include the first years free insurance otherwise that could be one more thing you will have to pay for as well as equipment and local licencing fees.
8. How much does your trainer charge for their treatments?
Now to me, this is one of the most important things you need to find out. Is the person you are going to be training with charging higher or lower than the industry standard?
They should be charging more than the average permanent makeup technician, because 9 times out of ten, price reflects education.
*****************************************
The price your trainer charges strongly co-relates to the price that your clients will be willing to pay you after you have trained with them i.e. if your trainer can only charge between £200 and £300 per treatment and they have been doing it years then what does that mean you can charge once you have been trained by them?
*****************************************
9. How easy is it to train with them, i.e. will your training experience be simple to complete.
I know this sounds an odd question, but you wouldn't believe the horror stories we hear from students coming to us for re-training & confidence boosting. Examples like having to bring all their own models for treatments, even if the training course is hundreds of miles away, needing to sort out their own treatment insurance & not being allowed to ever use any other products or services other than theirs the list goes on.
The little things really do count . Will they pick you up from your hotel each day if you dont drive. Do they recommend local hotels or B & Bs where previous students have stayed. Will they provide models for you for your initial training to save you the hassle of getting 4 - 6 friends and family members to come with you to your training course (surely you prefer to save them for your own models and case studies before your assessment day).
All I am trying to do here is make you aware that if you have to jump through hoops & meet lots of terms and conditions before you even get accepted onto the course or in order to complete the course, then you have to question how over-complicated their training may be as well.
10. Does the company care about you & your needs?
What I mean here is, do you get the feeling, you know, the gut feeling, that the company you are speaking to really care about you or are they only interested in selling their courses?
At The Permanent Makeup Training Academy, we know that every single student of ours can be training with us for different reasons. You might be starting a whole new career in the industry, you may wish to add a high end treatment to your existing beauty skills, you may be a new mum looking to start work again but want to work part time hours whilst earning a full time wage, you may be a salon owner looking to delegate the lower end treatments to staff & only concentrate on the high profit margin treatments like permanent makeup, you may want to add another £10,000 - £20,000 to your income by working an extra day or 2 a week or wanting to make £100,000 + and concentrate on it full time & so on ..
It is because of this that we tailor each training course to the individual taking it. This is not something that can be done if you are training in a group environment as you are all generally taught the same things no matter what your individual goals, dreams & aspirations are.
When speaking to the company you are thinking of training with you need to decide on whether or not you think they are they easily approachable. Why? Because there will be times after your initial training where you will need to speak to someone, probably the person who trained you, so do you get the feeling that they are friendly, welcoming and helpful to speak and deal with.
If not, I would advise considering trying a different training company. One that puts your needs and individual circumstances first.
11. What on-going support & future training courses does your permanent makeup training company offer you?
Although this should really go without saying, youd be amazed at how hard it can be to get hold of the person that trained you for a quick question as you have a client waiting on your beauty couch for their permanent makeup treatment.
Try and find a company that you have access to as often as you feel you may need it. Many companies say they offer 24 or 12 hours a day support to their students, but make sure that this is not just via email i.e., make sure you have a hotline number you can call in for essential need to know now questions. The last thing you need when you have a quick question that can be answered in a matter of seconds if you can get hold of the right person, is to wait 3 days for an email reply!
Also it is worth finding out what advanced permanent makeup training courses the company you are thinking about training with for your initial training can offer you. Training can be very addictive, so once you have mastered the initial skill of permanent makeup, it will only be natural that you want to improve and enhance those skills at a later date. Make sure the company you train with has potential to help you grow in your new career.
12. What help can your training company offer you in terms of the business & marketing side of permanent makeup?
The great thing about choosing a career in permanent makeup is that it is a relatively low cost business to start up. Once you have completed your initial training & got your machine & start up kit, the only real cost you will have (unless you intend to set up a high street clinic etc.) is to learn how to market your services.
There are so many low cost options that you can take advantage of to keep your costs low, such as working from home, mobile or renting rooms in beauty salons by the hour etc., that initially, you really shouldnt need to spend an awful lot more than your original training cost to get going.
The difference between you and your local permanent makeup competitors (if you have any in your area), is only really down to one thing. Your business skills & your marketing skills.
Marketing & learning how to market your permanent makeup skills is an essential must, to anyone serious about making some real money and a truly rewarding career out of this skill. Anyone can plod along doing 1 or 2 clients a week charging £200 - £300 per client once they have mastered the skill of permanent makeup.
However, the difference between doing that and having clients queuing up to use you when you are charging double or even triple those prices is simply down to how your market yourself and your permanent makeup services.
I always believe that if you are going to do something, then you may as well do it properly. This is why we are the only company that runs dedicated 3 day business & marketing courses for permanent makeup technicians on an invite only basis.
Only when you have mastered this skill are you ready to really market your services properly. Whats the point of getting hundreds of clients from day 1, if you cant do an amazing job for them?
You will only be selling yourself short & end up disappointing what might have been raving fans of your permanent makeup business in the future by doing them to soon.
One Final Bit of Advice
When researching to find the best possible training, remember, it is very personal to yourself, so one last tip would be to have a look at their website and the language they use.
Is it friendly and easy to understand or do you have to be a genius to work out what it means?
I hope that this helps you and anyone else reading this thread.
If you have any other questions or would like to pick my brains about helping you start your career in permanent makeup please feel free to call my office on 01444 300157 at any time.
I also have over 180 student video reviews on my YouTube Channel at permanentmakeupuk - YouTube
Good Luck with whoever you choose to train with.
Katy x
samantha14
Member
Do you learn enough with the finishing touches ? It doesnt really offer levels or any other course , only concern is it doesnt seem long enough . dermace look good but same again , do I get enough variations in tecqniues or do I have to buy all these advanced courses after or in the case of noeveau chose a platnium or gold? This is such a hard decision to make especially when there is so much money involved . Help please girls
skingeek78
Well-Known Member
Do you learn enough with the finishing touches ? It doesnt really offer levels or any other course , only concern is it doesnt seem long enough . dermace look good but same again , do I get enough variations in tecqniues or do I have to buy all these advanced courses after or in the case of noeveau chose a platnium or gold? This is such a hard decision to make especially when there is so much money involved . Help please girls
With any company you train with you need to start with the basics and then work up after you have mastered them. So in answer to your question you will need to further invest. My advice is to choose a good well established company with a sound reputation. Training isnt cheap but it pays to invest if you are serious about progressing as a permanent make up professional x
