Gel As Mma???

[Nails at Home]

Could anyone help me out on this one please? I had to turn down a potential new client yesterday as I simply don't have the time anymore to fit in a new regular :sad:

Anyway, she went to a local shop last night cos she was desperate for nails to be done for Friday. She was charged £35 - told them she wanted gel sculptures with french manicure - after the first sculpture the guy told her it looked awful and he would do the rest with tips. This was after using the dreaded electric file to prepare her natural nails of which he made very sore.

He finished them off very badly i.e. no uniform shape and very square and false looking. He had also painted on only clear gel and expected her to leave with no french. After she insisted on the french he airbrushed this on but by this morning it was already chipping! She went back to the shop today complaining that she wanted a refund or at least to have them removed but after much hesitation the guy eventually filed them to a better shape and airbrushed them again. Apparently the whole of the time he was doing nails he was also making out his english was not very good even though when he answered the phone it was perfectly OK!

Out of curiosity I took the number of the salon and asked out of interest what gel they used - I use Bio Sculpture (a soak off gel myself). He answered with "clear gel"! I said what brand? He said "my own brand" but I'll have to see your nails first!! Errrrr????? I said, so you don't use a professional make of gel then and he then said IBD! Needless to say I was not very convinced.

Now what I'm trying to get to anyway is if this guy isn't using a professional make of gel can "cowboy nail technicians" make up some sort of mix of gel themselves and could it be at all associated with the dreaded MMA?

Answers greatly appreciated - thanks!

Michelle x

 

[Sassy Hassy]

Very quickly as I have to make supper before going to college tonight.

Chances are it wasn't a gel, these places often say they are using gel when in fact it's l&p (i've heard of it quite a few times), or they just put a gel topcoat on.

If it was a gel though then it wouldn't have been MMA, as far as I'm aware there isn't an MMA gel as the MMA exists in the liquid monomer of l&p. Whatever is was it is probably a very cheap brand.

However it does sound like the antics of an NSS salon - over filing (with e-file, or hand file), no consultation, not listening to clients' wishes etc etc and should be avoided at all costs.

 

[Nails at Home]

Thanks for the info Sas - she definitely says that it was gel that they used so I guess you're probably right in that it's a cheap brand they use. Unfortunately she has called me again and within a few hours 1 nail has come off and another two are falling off! Good news is she complained again and the guy gave her a full refund - was very rude though telling her he has other clients who never complain! Yeah I'm sure!!!

I'm now fitting her in for a full set tomorrow evening but looks like I'll have to file off as much of the old gel (being extra careful not to make more damage to her natural nails) and just maybe keep a thin layer to build up my bio sculpture on. Am still concerned though at the fact that they've probably damaged her own nails so much that my sculptures may not last! I have made this clear though and as long as she's got them on for Friday she's very understanding! :wink2:

Take care

Michelle x

 

[Envy]

Almost all gel systems use Acrylates as the base. They are not methacrylate based at all. However they still pose a fairly high allergen rate. So gel really could never be accused of being MMA.

The three main familys of "acrylics" that are in the enhancement industry are:

Cyanoacrylates - adhesive
Acrylates - Gel systems (generally)
Methacrylates (primarily EMA) - Liquid and powder systems and BRiSA gel.

Hope that helps.
Envy

 

[Mrs Geek]

Because 'this guy' probably thinks this client 'knew nothing' - he will probably say whatever he feels and protest to 'not understanding' when questioned in depth... not all salons are like this thank god but at least this girl didn't take the first set lightly and went back in and complained... good on her!!!

This type of practise (drilling natural nails) should be a thing of the past within the next few years... there are a few of us on here (mum, chocolate, myself) - desperately working with THE BEST governemt board to change these practises...
right now, educating your clients is the ONLY clear and concise thing you can do to spread correct info about what we do.... keep on doing it - it is working!!!!

 

[Nails at Home]

Thanks Mrs Geek - I must admit that it's due to these sort of "nail technicians" (as they seem to be able to call themselves!) that I've been starting to lose some interest in doing nails - when you've spent as much money and time on training as I have (and I'm sure many others on this site have also) it makes me wanna weep when these cowboys try and take over with little or no experience (and certainly no concern for the clients except for wanting their money!) and give nails a bad name! Luckily for this client she knows we're not all bad as she came recommended from one of my existing clients!

Take care
Michelle x

 

[taintz]

This type of practise (drilling natural nails) should be a thing of the past within the next few years... there are a few of us on here (mum, chocolate, myself) - desperately working with THE BEST governemt board to change these practises...

I'm so torn with this because I have seen the damage done by people who are not trained AND I have seen the benefits of using an e-file to prep the nails.

I know Creative is anti e-efile but I wondered if you had perhaps done some e-file training ?

I have just completed my Ez-Flow Masters Course which includes an E-File Masters certificate and part of that certificate is learning how to prepare the natural nail properly using an e-file.

Now before everyone screams in horror - The bit used is a fine diamond bit called an ez flow prepper and the e-file is set to it's lowest possible speed. It means an effective & speedy preperation without damage to the nailplate IN THE RIGHT HANDS which is something I can't stress enough.

I also know that AEFM training in the USA also teaches these same methods.

This and the fact that I use this method on myself and my clients with great success and no suffering of any damage, rings of fire or thin nail plates or anything else that would have me believe this was bad would have to leave me with the statement that "The preparation of natural nails with an e-file will not cause any damage to the nails IF IN THE HANDS OF A CORRECTLY TRAINED TECHNICIAN"
And I really can't help but stress this enough.
Remember it is the same with a handfile.

I think that the damage being caused by those who are untrained like those in the NSS are causing great damage to our industry but making blanket statements like E-files are Bad or using an E-File on natural nails will damage them etc are causing more harm than good to those who are educating themselves and doing the right thing.

Rant over LoL

 

[Nails at Home]

I agree entirely as to the use of e-files - it's definitely the type of tool which should only be used by someone with the proper training - and as usual the NSS salons seem to love these tools because of the speed at which they can do a set of nails - even though they've probably NEVER had a minute's training on them!

 

[Mrs Geek]

I know Creative is anti e-efile but I wondered if you had perhaps done some e-file training ?

Hi Taintz - well let's see, Creative have never seen the need to use drills because of the way we train our students. However, we have been looking into the concept of drills knowing how popular they have become in the States.

I have just completed my Ez-Flow Masters Course which includes an E-File Masters certificate and part of that certificate is learning how to prepare the natural nail properly using an e-file.

Now before everyone screams in horror - The bit used is a fine diamond bit called an ez flow prepper and the e-file is set to it's lowest possible speed. It means an effective & speedy preperation without damage to the nailplate IN THE RIGHT HANDS which is something I can't stress enough.

OK - I'm not screaming but I am going to be honest! You sound like a responsible technician but we all know that teks all over (many of us here) have damaged natural nails with abrasives because of being over zealous etc... You may have had success with filing the natural nail with an E File - but there is so much negative talk about EFiles (because of so much malpractice that has gone on) that it will be very difficult to convince the general public that filing their natural nails with an EFile is really OK - if so much damage can be caused with normal hand abrasives - surely it will be 100 times worse with EFiles.

"The preparation of natural nails with an e-file will not cause any damage to the nails IF IN THE HANDS OF A CORRECTLY TRAINED TECHNICIAN"

I totally understand where you are coming from and maybe I would trust YOU Taintz to do that but you are 1 in so many who won't show love, care or attention... to be really honest have a drill go anywhere near my natural nails SCARES the hell out of me!

I think that the damage being caused by those who are untrained like those in the NSS are causing great damage to our industry

This is assuming that those who are trained do not cause damage to natural nails which we all know is not true!!

OK look here's what kills me! Nearly ALL companies in the UK DON'T CARE IF YOU ARE TRAINED OR NOT - only one company that I know of since 1988 has insisted on training standards PERIOD. Maybe just maybe if other companies insisted on training the people that go to them - many teks out there would know more rights than wrongs as practicing nail teks. It's no good blaming (and I am not saying you are Taints - just in general) NSS and any poor person who happens to be from Vietnam, the Phillapeans or Korea - FACT - COMPANIES have a RESPONSIBILITY and everyone conveniently forgets this when talking about the subject of damage. How CAN a person know how to use an abrasive correctly or understand grits if the company selling these products never took the responsibility or time to show and educate them in the first place
OK my Rant over....

 

[taintz]

We are having the same problems in Australia as training is not compulsory here meaning jo blo off the street can open a salon and do nails

I suppose because I push hard for training for myself I would view anyone who was a true professional to do the same.

It's a shame that our governments don't understand that nail technicians have the power to do more damage than hair dressers, beauty therapists etc (unless of course they do laser or dermabrasion)