Quantcast

Base 5, wanting 10, without bleach, using Goldwell?

SalonGeek

Help Support SalonGeek:

nickynok

Active Member
Joined
Jun 2, 2010
Messages
31
Reaction score
7
Location
dartford, kent
Hi all,
Haven't been on here in absolutely years! Just wants to pick some brains! I'm a mobile Hairdresser,
I have a client that I've had for absolute years, who has always had Majimeche hi lights...she's a base of about a 5. She wanted to change from having hi lights, to having an all over tint, due to starting to have grey coming through, and also moving to Devon (Im in Kent) but still wants to come to me, but try to stretch her appointments out a little.
I usually use Goldwell, so to changeover, I used 10ml 9N, 10ml, 9A, 10ml Blonding Cream Ash & 10ml 11SN with 60 mls of 12% developer. The roots were still somewhat warm (its lifting to between 8-9 I would say). I then used a Goldwell 10c express toner which knocked out a little warmth, but not masses.
The next time, I put some foil through the t-section with the majimeche, as I thought that might lighten it enough for her and did the same again on the roots, and again used the same toner, but next visit she said she wanted to have something not so warm. She doesn't want to resort to bleach though.

I've spoken to Goldwell Technical Support this morning, who have advised Neutralights Ash, mixed with Blonding cream, and then toning to blend the length and ends, dependant upon the result. I've not used the Neutralights before, so not sure how well this will lift....but the gut instinct part of me is also thinking this isn't going to achieve the result she wants, so I think I want to consider more options....what do you guys think??? Have not worked in a salon now for about 10 years, so Im a bit out of it in some respects! She's such a loyal client, that I want to do what I can to give her what she wants...A photos attached from her last visit, before I coloured it, so you can get an idea of what I mean xxx
IMG_7332.JPG
 

Haircutz

Super Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Premium Geek
Joined
Aug 11, 2011
Messages
10,547
Reaction score
6,784
Location
West Cork, Ireland
If she’s a 5, you need to use bleach and 6% or 9% max, then tone. Anything else is unlikely to lift it beyond an orangey/yellow 8.
 

nickynok

Active Member
Joined
Jun 2, 2010
Messages
31
Reaction score
7
Location
dartford, kent
If she’s a 5, you need to use bleach and 6% or 9% max, then tone. Anything else is unlikely to lift it beyond an orangey/yellow 8.
That's what I was thinking, but I know shes hoping to avoid that....Have you any experience with using the Goldwell Neutralifts?? xxx
 

Haircutz

Super Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Premium Geek
Joined
Aug 11, 2011
Messages
10,547
Reaction score
6,784
Location
West Cork, Ireland
I do use Goldwell but I find the highlifts won’t lift really cool on anything lower than say an 8 and a 6 will end up neutral to warm in most cases.
I find it really frustrating when clients are adamant about not having bleach because they mistakenly believe tint & 12% is kinder to hair than bleach plus 6% !
 

nickynok

Active Member
Joined
Jun 2, 2010
Messages
31
Reaction score
7
Location
dartford, kent
I do use Goldwell but I find the highlifts won’t lift really cool on anything lower than say an 8 and a 6 will end up neutral to warm in most cases.
I find it really frustrating when clients are adamant about not having bleach because they mistakenly believe tint & 12% is kinder to hair than bleach plus 6% !
I had a feeling that they wouldn't lift high enough...I'm sure they possibly do lift a little higher when in foils, but you've confirmed what I was originally thinking! I haven't used bleach for an on scalp application in years...I last used L'oreal Platinium...what bleaches are most gentle for on scalp these days hon and is there a nice toner you would recommend?

She loves the look of a 10N (which I've been telling her we're unlikely to achieve), but if we're going to end up using bleach anyway, she'll get there! She just doesn't want it to look too warm, or too ash (Lol, bit like Goldilocks!)
also...now thinking ahead to what my next question will be....to prevent banding...would you apply the bleach to the scalp first, or with a lower volume to the previously tinted hair, then the scalp/roots area (I'm pretty sure the mid-lengths and ends will be a lot lighter as I've not seen her in about 8 weeks) I'm concerned that otherwise theres going to be a lot of banding in that section, especially in the crown area, as shes naturally a lot darker there xxx
 

nickynok

Active Member
Joined
Jun 2, 2010
Messages
31
Reaction score
7
Location
dartford, kent

HairxByxMollie

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2017
Messages
136
Reaction score
29
Location
Wrexham
you can get highlift colours with added tones in them, such as ash , salon direct and others do them x
 

EssexFreelance

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 12, 2017
Messages
382
Reaction score
130
Location
Essex
Yes neutralights is good in this case or strongest highlift is 10ml 11V 8ml BCash 2ml Pmix for 60 mins
 

ELLE BELLA

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2017
Messages
262
Reaction score
108
Location
uk
The benefits of hi lift is that it’s done in one process , however you are unlikely to achieve anything higher than a level 9 on a 5 base
Not everyone wants to be ultra blonde and if it can be done in one go I’m all for that
I have customer s that I use high lift tint 12% and have no problem with condition of their hair , also customer s whom I bleach them tone
 

nickynok

Active Member
Joined
Jun 2, 2010
Messages
31
Reaction score
7
Location
dartford, kent
you can get highlift colours with added tones in them, such as ash , salon direct and others do them x
Yeah, I realise that, but Hilift tint isn't going to give it enough lift I'm afraid, or I would use that, if it were a base of a 7, at the lowest xxx
 

nickynok

Active Member
Joined
Jun 2, 2010
Messages
31
Reaction score
7
Location
dartford, kent
The benefits of hi lift is that it’s done in one process , however you are unlikely to achieve anything higher than a level 9 on a 5 base
Not everyone wants to be ultra blonde and if it can be done in one go I’m all for that
I have customer s that I use high lift tint 12% and have no problem with condition of their hair , also customer s whom I bleach them tone
Oh me too! I'd much rather a hi-lift tint, as its not as volatile as bleach too, and much less chance of banding occurring....but I know hi-lift tint isn't going to lift it enough for her, as when I very first started doing her hair, I used to use HiLift, and it still used to be too warm....hence why we started using Majimech, as it brings it up to a nice creamy blonde for her....Unless I use a hi-lift and then still tone after to counteract any warmth....if so.....what would you guys recommend????

I've read through a few posts where people are recommending Blondme? Anyone recommend using this, and then a toner after? As I said earlier, she's after a 10N kind of tone...no warmth, but not too ash, but of course like I say, she has a lot of natural warmth xxx
 

nickynok

Active Member
Joined
Jun 2, 2010
Messages
31
Reaction score
7
Location
dartford, kent
Yes neutralights is good in this case or strongest highlift is 10ml 11V 8ml BCash 2ml Pmix for 60 mins
Do you think Neutralights would be enough lift? or would I just be better off discussing the benefits of bleach with her with a low volume peroxide & toner? I just dont want to not get the desired result, so then end up having to redo it and having to resort to bleach anyway xxx
 

Haircutz

Super Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Premium Geek
Joined
Aug 11, 2011
Messages
10,547
Reaction score
6,784
Location
West Cork, Ireland
Blondme is a great bleach and will lift it to a 10, no problem.
 

HairbyCass

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 21, 2013
Messages
196
Reaction score
3
Location
NSW Australia
Blonde me is great. You'll get to a clean 9-10 with toning no problems.
I'd apply on roots with 6% starting at the darkest area (crown) process for 20/30 mins (check to see that it's coming up close in level to the highlift areas) then reapply with 6% again, this time covering the root and highlift area.

Level 5 to a 10 in a clean lift is nearly impossible to achieve with anything other than bleach and toner. It's been a while since I've used Goldwell but I found 10V colorance to be my favourite go to blonde toner for after scalp bleach. It rarely overtones unless you've got serious porosity issues, and gives great shine and condition to the hair.

Careful bleach applications, followed by toning and proper at home hair care and regular trims result in hair that is in just as good a condition as hair that is lifted with a highlift.
Just take thin sections and be sure to be careful with your application and not to overlap onto already bleached hair.
Beyond that, olaplex/cureplex/all the plexes! Are great for this sort of colour work too.

She needs to understand she can't be that blonde without putting some serious love and care back into her hair herself. It's a big process to lift that far and the hair needs ongoing nurturing as a result.
 

nickynok

Active Member
Joined
Jun 2, 2010
Messages
31
Reaction score
7
Location
dartford, kent
That’s brilliant, thanks for that! I’m gonna have a little chat with her and go from there.

Appreciate your responses... always good to bounce your thoughts around...that’s the only thing I miss from being in a salon to be truthful xxx
 

nickynok

Active Member
Joined
Jun 2, 2010
Messages
31
Reaction score
7
Location
dartford, kent
Blonde me is great. You'll get to a clean 9-10 with toning no problems.
I'd apply on roots with 6% starting at the darkest area (crown) process for 20/30 mins (check to see that it's coming up close in level to the highlift areas) then reapply with 6% again, this time covering the root and highlift area.

Level 5 to a 10 in a clean lift is nearly impossible to achieve with anything other than bleach and toner. It's been a while since I've used Goldwell but I found 10V colorance to be my favourite go to blonde toner for after scalp bleach. It rarely overtones unless you've got serious porosity issues, and gives great shine and condition to the hair.

Careful bleach applications, followed by toning and proper at home hair care and regular trims result in hair that is in just as good a condition as hair that is lifted with a highlift.
Just take thin sections and be sure to be careful with your application and not to overlap onto already bleached hair.
Beyond that, olaplex/cureplex/all the plexes! Are great for this sort of colour work too.

She needs to understand she can't be that blonde without putting some serious love and care back into her hair herself. It's a big process to lift that far and the hair needs ongoing nurturing as a result.
Would you recommend using their developer, or can I use any hon? Xxx
 

HairbyCass

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 21, 2013
Messages
196
Reaction score
3
Location
NSW Australia
With the blondeme range I'd use the blonde me developer. It will work with generic developer (or another brand), but you will see more benifits of the colour if you use the blondeme developer.
You should charge accordingly if you are using specific products to achieve something beyond run of the mill products as well.
 

Reidebot

Down the Rabbit hole.
Joined
Dec 7, 2014
Messages
702
Reaction score
91
Location
Australia
Is she afraid of bleach? I am not sure about goldwell howeverI had a client who was a little darker who has severe anxiety. She wanted blond onscalp 0 bleach.

I used to use muk 1111 highlift (or 1121 if we had it on hand but we rarely ordered it) on her hair and then tone it out if needed. The highlift by muk has a maximum time of 55 mins so I would follow that. She was content as it came out of a tube and was not powder.
 

Latest posts

Top