Perm help/advice please read

[suzz79]

I did a perm on an older lady who has quite short hair. I used the smallest rod i could, as she wanted tight curls. I used wella curl it intense as it said on the manu instructions, it was for normal - fine hair with no colour or bleach. I followed the instructions and it came out good, i used the pre-treatment before i started and used an antioxidant conditioner to stop the creeping oxidisation afterwards. I then carefully set the hair. She has now phoned me saying it hasn't stayed in and its gone flat. I asked her if she has washed her hair and she said she doesn't wash it between visits to have it set or permed. I said you need to wash it at least once a week else it won't spring back. Am i right or did i do something wrong?

 

[lynn amber]

Would say you are right yes, if she doesn't wash it at all of course it will go flat

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[babychops]

How does she know that it has come out and gone flat if she hasn't washed it? She probably means that her blow dry has gone flat (as it does) I would go round there and wash her hair and show her the curls x

 

[rocca]

I absolutely agree with the asumption that if a client hasn't washed her hair (since the perm) she would have no way of knowing if it had gone truly flat. Sleeping on hair will flatten it and the test for a successful perm is the first wash.

However, what I would say is I would never usually recommend using an anti-oxidant conditioner after a perm. It's a double edged sword, but perms need that creeping oxidation in the 48 hours following the perm. In neutralising, perhaps only 30% of the bonds are re-connected with the 10 minute neutraliser process. The remaining bonds start connecting via air oxidation in the 48 hours that follow. This is the reason why you have to tell clients not to wash their hair for 2 days after a perm. If you use an anti-oxidant conditioner, you are effectively stopping the oxygen getting into the hair and allowing these bonds to connect.

I would tend to use anti-oxy's after any lightening service, where you need to stop that peroxide from remaining in the hair. With perming (and permanent straightening), the peroxide strength is so low in the neutraliser (less than 3 vol) that it's ability to creep is much lower and with the neutraliser you do need it to do this to a certain degree.

 

[Amberjox]

I absolutely agree with the asumption that if a client hasn't washed her hair (since the perm) she would have no way of knowing if it had gone truly flat. Sleeping on hair will flatten it and the test for a successful perm is the first wash.

However, what I would say is I would never usually recommend using an anti-oxidant conditioner after a perm. It's a double edged sword, but perms need that creeping oxidation in the 48 hours following the perm. In neutralising, perhaps only 30% of the bonds are re-connected with the 10 minute neutraliser process. The remaining bonds start connecting via air oxidation in the 48 hours that follow. This is the reason why you have to tell clients not to wash their hair for 2 days after a perm. If you use an anti-oxidant conditioner, you are effectively stopping the oxygen getting into the hair and allowing these bonds to connect.

I would tend to use anti-oxy's after any lightening service, where you need to stop that peroxide from remaining in the hair. With perming (and permanent straightening), the peroxide strength is so low in the neutraliser (less than 3 vol) that it's ability to creep is much lower and with the neutraliser you do need it to do this to a certain degree.

Interesting!! Learn something new every day xx

 

[persianista]

I absolutely agree with the asumption that if a client hasn't washed her hair (since the perm) she would have no way of knowing if it had gone truly flat. Sleeping on hair will flatten it and the test for a successful perm is the first wash.

However, what I would say is I would never usually recommend using an anti-oxidant conditioner after a perm. It's a double edged sword, but perms need that creeping oxidation in the 48 hours following the perm. In neutralising, perhaps only 30% of the bonds are re-connected with the 10 minute neutraliser process. The remaining bonds start connecting via air oxidation in the 48 hours that follow. This is the reason why you have to tell clients not to wash their hair for 2 days after a perm. If you use an anti-oxidant conditioner, you are effectively stopping the oxygen getting into the hair and allowing these bonds to connect.

I would tend to use anti-oxy's after any lightening service, where you need to stop that peroxide from remaining in the hair. With perming (and permanent straightening), the peroxide strength is so low in the neutraliser (less than 3 vol) that it's ability to creep is much lower and with the neutraliser you do need it to do this to a certain degree.

Sorry, but I don't agree with this theory. It's important to apply anti-oxidant after a perm to stop further oxidation. It's a well known fact that over neutralising causes a perm to reverse.

 

[lynn amber]

Sorry, but I don't agree with this theory. It's important to apply anti-oxidant after a perm to stop further oxidation. It's a well known fact that over neutralising causes a perm to reverse.

This is what I was always tought and its worked well for me the last 16 years also rinse, rinse and rinse some more

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[Divajojo]

I think you need to see her, wash her hair then you will see how curly the perm is and how it's taken. You can't tell when it's dry and after sleeping on it, it will go flat! X