Posting my photos done in another salon?

[Wildfirenails]

Hi all!

I have "failed a probation" salon and due to personal differences with the owner. (She was a bit of a mean girl) and decided to make a go of it on my own.
I was employed there for a short time, not self employed.
However I have a large portfolio of photos I took while working there that I would like to post.
Does anyone know the rules on this? My plan was still to hashtag and mention the company I was previously working for. Thanks for your help

 

[Trinity]

I'm sure Banner Penguin or one of the other more knowledgable Geeks will be around soon, but if you own the photographs (as in you have the originals, taken on your phone/camera/by you) of your work then you own the intellectual rights and do what you wish with them.

 

[Wildfirenails]

Excellent thank you!
I have started a seperate business alone so i am still mentioning the company where I produced the nails to give them credit. However they are my work and there is no copyright or watermarks on my pictures associating to them.

 

[AcidPerm]

No, you must stop!

Although you took the photographs, the work itself belongs to the salon as the Nails were 'created' whilst you were employed by them. It comes under the umbrella of Intellectual Property law and unless you have the salon owner's express permission to take them or reproduce them anywhere, she could successfully sue you.

 

[Wildfirenails]

Hi, thanks for your reply.

So this means now I have no portfolio at all? How can I get round this? As other girls from the salon have posted many pictures online of there work also.

 

[AcidPerm]

You may get lucky where the salon owner isn't too bothered and doesn't pursue you.
However, if you become successful and then she pursues you, it could get expensive.
Either ask the salon owner for permission to use them or start again from scratch.
It shouldn't take too long to build up a fresh portfolio of your work.
You could use a nail trainer hand to display your designs.

 

[Wildfirenails]

Thank u for your advise! I appreciate it.
Considering how my previous boss was I am certain I wouldnt be granted the rights to use them, however if I did use them, wouldnt it be as simple as "remove those photos" and I will?

 

[The Art of Beauty]

I don't agree -

Separate to this I own and run an event where I hire a photographer - the photographs he takes are owned by him not by me as they are his art whether done on my property or not. I own a Partial of them as in no one can use them without my or his permission but they are his and can and are used on his port folio :s

 

[Wildfirenails]

I know it's a bit if a grey area I feel.
As looking online alot of people do post previous work, but I'm just not sure.
Ive done alot of research and its coming up one or two ways : I own the photos, the photos are not copyrighted or watermarked, its my work so use then. Or it was taken in someone elses salon, therefore meaning the salon owner owns them.
I want to do everything by the book but would also like to use my photos if I could.

 

[The Art of Beauty]

If they are on your phone then I'd say they are yours they have no proof that hey where taken where

 

[asteropi]

Since there was no contract between you then both of you have partial property of the photos, as you were the artist but you were also employed at the time. Legally you require the owner's permission to use them, and so does she require yours. Models also have the right to an opinion, although not ownership, but they can deny you the right to post them as again there was no contract. I'd say you can reach an agreement where you can both post them stating clearly whose work it was.
Of course if she didn't know you took them then as mentioned above she can't prove it anyway, unless you mention clients' names or her salon is in the background.

 

[Trinity]

I know it's a bit if a grey area I feel.
As looking online alot of people do post previous work, but I'm just not sure.
Ive done alot of research and its coming up one or two ways : I own the photos, the photos are not copyrighted or watermarked, its my work so use then. Or it was taken in someone elses salon, therefore meaning the salon owner owns them.
I want to do everything by the book but would also like to use my photos if I could.

It's a proper grey area for sure, I've just spend 10 minutes Googling and am no further forward than when I started. Some say photographer 'owns' the image, some say as an employee the employer 'owns' the images.

 

[Wildfirenails]

My feelings are that if i post them worst case I can I be asked to remove them - which i would. Im fairly new starting out so the photos would be very useful to me to find a client basis. I dont presume the first protocall is instantly sue me, I'm sure more tame measures are taken first (Well i hope anyway haha)

 

[Wildfirenails]

Do you think I should credit the salon or not?

 

[rachelizabeth]

Do you think I should credit the salon or not?

What are the pictures like? Are they just close ups or can you tell they were taken at the salon...as in will the salon owner recognise them or could they be pictures of nails you've done outside the salon?

 

[laurakate]

No idea what the official rules are but if she can't prove where the photos were taken then I'd say that you don't have much to worry about. Crop them maybe?

Don't credit the salon. You did the work. Balls to them.

 

[AcidPerm]

Ok, I think some of you are getting confused with Intellectual Property law and Breach of Copyright.
In this instance, it's got nothing to do with who took or owns the photographs. That's a bit of a red herring.

******************
Consider the following two scenarios;

Imagine you're employed by the House of Chanel to sew up the sample dresses designed by Karl Largerfeld prior to the launch of the next seasons collection. Would you think it's perfectly legal to take photographs of them and use them to advertise your own dress alterations shop that you work in at the weekend?

In the Nail Salon:
Supposing during the course of employment, a well known celebrity entered the salon and asked the owner for an exclusive and unique design on her nails.
The owner asks employee A to come up with an idea.
Employee A designs something spectacular.
The celebrity is really pleased and Employee A takes some pictures of the celebrity wearing the new Nail design to show her friends and family.


The standard rule applied when considering ownership of Intellectual Property is that any work made by an employee in the course of employment belongs to the employer, unless otherwise agreed.

Therefore, the ownership of all of the nail designs that Employee A does during her hours of work legally belong to the salon. They were created whilst Employee A was being employed to do her job.

Employee A has no legal ownership of the nail design and so cannot use images of it for personal gain without the salon owners express permission.

**********************************************************

It's completely irrelevant who took the photographs.

 

[asteropi]

Ok, I think some of you are getting confused with Intellectual Property law and Breach of Copyright.
In this instance, it's got nothing to do with who took or owns the photographs. That's a bit of a red herring.

******************
Consider the following two scenarios;

Imagine you're employed by the House of Chanel to sew up the sample dresses designed by Karl Largerfeld prior to the launch of the next seasons collection. Would you think it's perfectly legal to take photographs of them and use them to advertise your own dress alterations shop that you work in at the weekend?

In the Nail Salon:
Supposing during the course of employment, a well known celebrity entered the salon and asked the owner for an exclusive and unique design on her nails.
The owner asks employee A to come up with an idea.
Employee A designs something spectacular.
The celebrity is really pleased and Employee A takes some pictures of the celebrity wearing the new Nail design to show her friends and family.


The standard rule applied when considering ownership of Intellectual Property is that any work made by an employee in the course of employment belongs to the employer, unless otherwise agreed.

Therefore, the ownership of all of the nail designs that Employee A does during her hours of work legally belong to the salon. They were created whilst Employee A was being employed to do her job.

Employee A has no legal ownership of the nail design and so cannot use images of it for personal gain without the salon owners express permission.

**********************************************************

It's completely irrelevant who took the photographs.

Question:
in your first example the sample dresses were designed by Karl Largefeld and your employee only did the sewing. Therefore the intellectual property of the dresses belongs to Karl.
In your second example however, Employee A came up with the idea. Not the salon owner. Shouldn't the intellectual property of the design belong to the employee? Regardless of whether she was employed or not. Mind I only say the idea. And if that is the case, property of the photographs isn't then split between employee A and owner, as employee owns the idea, but owner the photographs themselves?

 

[AcidPerm]

Question:
in your first example the sample dresses were designed by Karl Largefeld and your employee only did the sewing. Therefore the intellectual property of the dresses belongs to Karl.
In your second example however, Employee A came up with the idea. Not the salon owner. Shouldn't the intellectual property of the design belong to the employee? Regardless of whether she was employed or not. Mind I only say the idea. And if that is the case, property of the photographs isn't then split between employee A and owner, as employee owns the idea, but owner the photographs themselves?

Yes, Employee A came up with the design, because that is what her employer was paying her to do.

It's a well established legal principle that designs/ideas created during the course of employment belong to the employer. Intellectual property law is concerned with the legal ownership of ideas.

It might be easier to understand the reasoning for this if you consider large organisations such as pharamaceutical companies, research centres, governments etc. that need to ensure that their employees don't use their facilities to make a breakthrough discovery and then try to sell the information/design to the highest bidder. The employer has invested in the employee by providing facilities, equipment, materials etc. to enable the employee to do a job that they receive payment for.

In the second example, the employee is being paid to create a unique nail design.
Her reward for doing her job (applying her technical skills and flair) is her wages.
The employer owns the design 100%.

In the first example, if the seamstress was also a designer employed by KL who designed and sewed up the samples, can she take photos of 'her' designs to advertise her dress alterations business?
.
.
Answer: No, because she is employed by Chanel as a designer (and seamstress) and under IP law, the designs belong to Chanel.