geeg
Judge Gigi-Honorary Geek
It is not all one thing or the other.... I'm sure lack of adhesion is due to may different factors.
Some people just CAN'T wear nails...?
- Thread starter VHunter
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Doug Schoon
Chemistry Geek
Hi,
Not everyone is a good candidate for wearing artificial nails. This can happen for a wide range of reasons. They may be secret pickers and their problems are self-inflicted or they may have their hands in cleaning solutions or in water too much or they may possess overly thinned/damaged nail plates or the nail plates could be excessively oily or the chemical composition of the nails surface may not allow for optimum adhesion, even the shape can affect adhesion, e.g. ski jump nails.
If you have one or two rare clients that can't wear artificial nails, then you're just unlucky. If you have more than two, you should reconsider how you are applying the product and/or think about the quality of the products you use.
Most clients should be able to successfully wear any high quality product, but a few will have to settle for a good manicure.
Doug Schoon
Chief Scientific Advisor
Creative Nail Design, Inc.
Not everyone is a good candidate for wearing artificial nails. This can happen for a wide range of reasons. They may be secret pickers and their problems are self-inflicted or they may have their hands in cleaning solutions or in water too much or they may possess overly thinned/damaged nail plates or the nail plates could be excessively oily or the chemical composition of the nails surface may not allow for optimum adhesion, even the shape can affect adhesion, e.g. ski jump nails.
If you have one or two rare clients that can't wear artificial nails, then you're just unlucky. If you have more than two, you should reconsider how you are applying the product and/or think about the quality of the products you use.
Most clients should be able to successfully wear any high quality product, but a few will have to settle for a good manicure.
Doug Schoon
Chief Scientific Advisor
Creative Nail Design, Inc.
Katmoz33
Well-Known Member
I have a lady that wants to grow her nails so we tried manicures, then bio, shellac, then gelish all of which only lasted a week!
She decided she wanted a set of acrylics on I though she would be worse with them as the shellac is the one I thought would last her the longest, but she came back to day she's had them on 3 weeks and they are perfect no lifting/breakages etc!
No idea why they have lasted and non of the others have, unless of course she's a secret picker?!
She decided she wanted a set of acrylics on I though she would be worse with them as the shellac is the one I thought would last her the longest, but she came back to day she's had them on 3 weeks and they are perfect no lifting/breakages etc!
No idea why they have lasted and non of the others have, unless of course she's a secret picker?!
geeg
Judge Gigi-Honorary Geek
Doug, thank you for taking the time to reply but your answer is the basic answer that we all know .. what Victoria and I want to know is ,, WHAT IS IT THAT ON THE RARE FEW WHO CANT WEAR ENHANCEMENTS, DETERMINS THAT THEY ARE NOT GOOD CANDIDATES? IS IT THE Ph OF THE NAIL SURFACE .. IS IT THE AMOUNT OF OIL IN THE PLATE? WHEN A PERSON SUFFERS EXTREME STRESS , WHAT CHANGES? IS IS THE Ph OR WHAT?? WHAT IS IT THAT MAKES NAILS THAT COULD WEAR NAIL ENHANCEMENTS .. SUDDENLY BECOME NAILS THAT CANNOT?
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VHunter
Well-Known Member
Yup, ditto what she said LOL
:hug:
:hug:
Doug Schoon
Chemistry Geek
It is unlikely that the nail will suddenly change in composition. If it did, it would take months before the new composition dominated the nail plate, since the nail's composition is mostly determined in the matrix.
My guess is that except for long term health problems, e.g. heart surgery or chemotherapy, it is unlikely that the nail plate is "changing" and that change will affect adhesion. The same is true for the rare few who can't wear enhancements due the composition of the nail. They will have this problem all the time... it won't occur suddenly.
My opinion is that the VAST majority of the time one or two client's nails have "unexplained" lifting problems, these are not related to the composition of the nail's surface, but instead, to what the client does after they leave the salon, in other words, life-style.
Client's will pick their nails in front of you and swear they don't. Their hands maybe red and chapped from washing dishes, yet they'll say they always wear gloves, etc.
Doug Schoon
My guess is that except for long term health problems, e.g. heart surgery or chemotherapy, it is unlikely that the nail plate is "changing" and that change will affect adhesion. The same is true for the rare few who can't wear enhancements due the composition of the nail. They will have this problem all the time... it won't occur suddenly.
My opinion is that the VAST majority of the time one or two client's nails have "unexplained" lifting problems, these are not related to the composition of the nail's surface, but instead, to what the client does after they leave the salon, in other words, life-style.
Client's will pick their nails in front of you and swear they don't. Their hands maybe red and chapped from washing dishes, yet they'll say they always wear gloves, etc.
Doug Schoon
VHunter
Well-Known Member
I hear what you're saying.
Here's an example.
Client no#1 has been coming for 3yrs. For 1.5yrs, she has had UV Gel, and suffered ZERO lift. She was very diligent with her oil and bought new oil regularly.
Suddenly she had lift.. everywhere and AWFUL.
I asked "what's new? what changes have you made? what have you been doing/using lately?"
She could think of nothing.
A couple of weeks later, she was at her Doctor's office.
He noticed the dreadful lift on her nails. He said to her "are they uv gel?" and she looked at him surprised and said "yes, how did you know?" (because really?? a doctor knowing about this stuff? not very common)
He said "my wife was wearing them too until she started her anti-depressants, now she can only wear acrylic. Uv Gel won't stick".
My client called me that afternoon, to tell me of her appointment and to apologize because she had started her anti-depressants a few months ago and didn't think to mention them when her lift had started a few months later. Not realizing that, AS YOU SAY, the effect would take time to reach the nail plate...
Now, she wears L&P and has zero problems. Granted, she is able to wear L&P and she's not one of those that can't wear anything.
BUT I'm just wondering what exactly those anti-depressants did to her nailplate?
Doug Schoon
Chemistry Geek
Hi Victoria,
I don't think that's convincing. Given how many people are on some type of anti-depressants these days and the fact that most people can wear artificial nails, I'd think it is more reasonable conclude the exact opposite. It appears to be highly unlikely that anti-depressants cause lifting.
What you are describing is called "anecdotal evidence" which is often just coincidence. I suspect that's how many myths get started. The information "seems" logical and to make sense, but that doesn't make it true.
But for this very interesting discussion, let's assume you're correct. The anti-depressants don't necessarily have to do something to the nail plate to cause lifting; they could be doing something to the person. Maybe the meds made her nervous so she started secretly picking, or compulsively cleaning? I'd think these are more likely explanations.
Doug
I don't think that's convincing. Given how many people are on some type of anti-depressants these days and the fact that most people can wear artificial nails, I'd think it is more reasonable conclude the exact opposite. It appears to be highly unlikely that anti-depressants cause lifting.
What you are describing is called "anecdotal evidence" which is often just coincidence. I suspect that's how many myths get started. The information "seems" logical and to make sense, but that doesn't make it true.
But for this very interesting discussion, let's assume you're correct. The anti-depressants don't necessarily have to do something to the nail plate to cause lifting; they could be doing something to the person. Maybe the meds made her nervous so she started secretly picking, or compulsively cleaning? I'd think these are more likely explanations.
Doug
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VHunter
Well-Known Member
But for picking and nibbling, the enhancements are 'forced' off and this tears the nail plate.
There was no evidence of such (and I've had some nibblers, was one myself, once upon a time, so I can spot them pretty good...STILL have some nibblers as clients who are trying to reform as we speak)
So when there is no evidence of nail plate trauma, then what?
If chemotherapy causes hair to fall out, and certain creams give me pimples, and certain medications cause issue to the kidneys etc etc; is it not possible that some medications cause chemical changes to the nail plate changing the surface?
Also, if it's down to prep: then why would it only be issue with the same clients every time and not the rest of them?
There was no evidence of such (and I've had some nibblers, was one myself, once upon a time, so I can spot them pretty good...STILL have some nibblers as clients who are trying to reform as we speak)
So when there is no evidence of nail plate trauma, then what?
If chemotherapy causes hair to fall out, and certain creams give me pimples, and certain medications cause issue to the kidneys etc etc; is it not possible that some medications cause chemical changes to the nail plate changing the surface?
Also, if it's down to prep: then why would it only be issue with the same clients every time and not the rest of them?
Wooshka
Well-Known Member
Thank you so much Doug for your time to explain this to us all
Your answers got me thinking, cause I would have to agree that changes in ones nails would not be so sudden as they come from the matrix., even though from what I experienced it felt this way as I did have other physical changes but after some research I have discovered that stress can cause one of my physical changes I had
It got me to thinking what I did differently (apart from my stress levels)with my nails/hands in the time I was having my very stressful time last week and when my nails became a mess.
Typing!!
Typing is the only thing I did huge amounts of compared to my normal amount and just listening to the amount of taps on my keyboard from typing this, I'm wondering if the constant pressure on the enhancements by being hit on the keys could have caused my problem.
I did less cleaning etc than I normally do in this stressful time, I pretty much just sat and typed email after email for 4 days straight.
I'm not asking you to answer this, I'm more thinking out loud, just looking into what you are saying about the client/me doing something different all of a sudden to cause these problems.
This does not explain my toes though but maybe it was just time for them to be re-done:lol:
Your answers got me thinking, cause I would have to agree that changes in ones nails would not be so sudden as they come from the matrix., even though from what I experienced it felt this way as I did have other physical changes but after some research I have discovered that stress can cause one of my physical changes I had
It got me to thinking what I did differently (apart from my stress levels)with my nails/hands in the time I was having my very stressful time last week and when my nails became a mess.
Typing!!
Typing is the only thing I did huge amounts of compared to my normal amount and just listening to the amount of taps on my keyboard from typing this, I'm wondering if the constant pressure on the enhancements by being hit on the keys could have caused my problem.
I did less cleaning etc than I normally do in this stressful time, I pretty much just sat and typed email after email for 4 days straight.
I'm not asking you to answer this, I'm more thinking out loud, just looking into what you are saying about the client/me doing something different all of a sudden to cause these problems.
This does not explain my toes though but maybe it was just time for them to be re-done:lol:
eternity31
Well-Known Member
I too have one lady(girl really) who cannot get past 2 days and they drop off whole as you describe - nothng sticks bio or shellac but she is on HRT both tableys and injections as she is only 24 but has endometris (not sure on correct spelling of endometrisis!) and I think this must be the reason?
purpleivy
Well-Known Member
I take HRT all of the time. I take antidepressants for at least 6 months of the year (as I have Seasonal Affective Disorder). I do housework.
I have had biosculpture on regularly and the hard 'acrylics' with tips. I've not had any significant lifting.
I have had biosculpture on regularly and the hard 'acrylics' with tips. I've not had any significant lifting.
beautyrus
Active Member
Hi,
This is an interesting thread!I have two clients who both suffer alot of lifting with acrylic.They are not on any medication yet the nails just completley peel off.I can see they are not picking them as the natural nail is not damaged in any way.They come to me every 2 weeks for infills and have stuck most back on with nail glue by the time they come back.I would love to find a solution.All my other clients have no problems and most go 3 weeks.I can only think they produce alot of natural oils???Wish i could find a a solution x
This is an interesting thread!I have two clients who both suffer alot of lifting with acrylic.They are not on any medication yet the nails just completley peel off.I can see they are not picking them as the natural nail is not damaged in any way.They come to me every 2 weeks for infills and have stuck most back on with nail glue by the time they come back.I would love to find a solution.All my other clients have no problems and most go 3 weeks.I can only think they produce alot of natural oils???Wish i could find a a solution x
