At a complete loss!

[aayspa]

Hi everyone,

I am a mobile tech providing CND Shellac and IBX to many clients and never have I been so stumped!

I have a lovely client who I treat every 2 weeks without fail who has delamination on her nails.

I'm not sure I've ever gone back to her after 2 weeks and found her nails with no chips unlike nearly all my other clients (some of which are cleaners and always have their hands in chemicals yet their shellac stays perfect for 3 weeks!).

I've tried everything with her, double top coating, Brisa Lite smoothing gel and since IBX was launched I even purchased that especially for her (although I do now use on others) and still her nails are a nightmare.

I know for a fact she is very hard on her nails and is always cooking etc and rarely wears her rubber gloves but it doesn't matter what I say it doesn't get through and she still blames the product even though her nails were always like it before.

She claims that the ends "just tip up and peel off" lol. Her words not mine. She used to blame the Shellac and now she's blaming the IBX saying it's causing them to lift off!

Everytime I leave her with 10 perfect nails and everytime I go back they are a total mess.

What can I do??!

Nails after shellac removal


Nails after IBX cured


Nails after scrub fresh


When I leave they look like this

And 3 days later I'll get this sent to me

I just don't know what to do anymore. Even cuticle away seems to eat away at her nails and they begin peeling in front of my eyes!

Please help. I just want her to have beautiful nails x

 

[sal365]

Wow that's after 3 days? Are you sure she is not a picker?
Have you tried just doing a dry prep on her instead of using cuticle away? Other than that maybe try Brisa lite sculpting overlay as it's a bit harder than the smoothing and may stop them bending enough for the shellac to hold?

 

[aayspa]

Wow that's after 3 days? Are you sure she is not a picker?
Have you tried just doing a dry prep on her instead of using cuticle away? Other than that maybe try Brisa lite sculpting overlay as it's a bit harder than the smoothing and may stop them bending enough for the shellac to hold?

I do think she's a picker, I suspect she doesn't use her oil too but she insists she does and that she doesn't do anything to them. The only thing she admits to is not wearing gloves. I can't exactly call her a liar and say to her if she doesn't pack it in there's nothing I can do lol.

I have tried dry prep but her cuticles can be quite stubborn and it then becomes uncomfortable.

Unfortunately I can't purchase sculpting gel as I'm not trained in enhancements. Something I must get round to but never have anyone ask so don't get round to it.

Her nails are definitely stronger with the IBX, her index and middle fingers never used to get a free edge before breaking so they are better than they were. I do believe the peeling is better too but just don't seem to be able to get the results my other clients have x

 

[Jazzyb]

I'm sorry I can't offer any helpful advice that's not already been said but I just wanted to say how lovely you paint, I'm trying so hard to get my shellac to look like perfect like that round the cuticles!

 

[2012salon]

Have you tried youngs protein bond?
It worked on my client who had eczema of the nails

 

[nailsRus]

Maybe the gel just isn't for her it doesn't sound like anything you're doing personally and I'm sorry if you know she doesn't wear gloves then yes you can tell her off lol I would ask her very politely to keep them out by the sink and Wear them and see if the Gel then lasts longer xx

Sent from my GT-I9300 using SalonGeek mobile app

 

[blossom]

You know sometimes you just have to accept the fact that every system isn't for every person.

Or she could be on meds that are affecting the adhesion of the Shellac. Or she might take a long hot bath every single night - or worse, every morning then maybe comes to you before they've really dried out, this could affect adhesion.

Have you only had problems with her nails since using IBX? I had a couple of ladies whose nails really seemed to hang on to the IBX, especially those with delamination as I think it got right in under all those little flaky bits (like its supposed to) but it gave me adhesion problems, now with those two ladies I finish with scrubfresh, then scrubfresh again, then use acetone for a final scrub before applying shellac, and it has made such a difference. Just a thought as I know it helped me. But if you had your probs with this lady before using ibx then i guess its not that.

Have you tried an acrylic overlay on her?

 

[squidgernetball]

I have come to the conclusion that there are some people who don't suit some products. I really would get the hump if I kept getting this. It happened with one client. We would literally get a message after about 3 days saying " sorry my shellac has chipped". We would repair then it would happen again. In the end I told her that we weren't prepared to treat her nails any more with shellac as it clearly didn't suit her nails.

You could read into this the other message that says "you don't look after them properly".
As a nail tech there is only so much you can do x

Sent from my GT-I9505 using SalonGeek mobile app

 

[blossom]

Actually, have a look at that last photo again with the chipped thumb. In the background you can see the tips of the other nails and every one of them has the seal missing, which you can see so clearly in the newly applied picture. I think she is using bleach/household chemicals without gloves and that is eating away at the seal, leading to lumps chipping off, of course....such as the thumb. I bet thats the reason.

Just re-read your first post and she admits to not wearing gloves. I think you have it here.

I dont understand why people pay money for a treatment and then fail to take the necessary steps to guard against damage. Its akin to having your hair cut and then letting your toddler loose on your head with the scissors.

 

[Nicolahayley]

I think ages definetly picking!! There's chips all in the shellac where it's 'peeled' I'm sure you are but are you definetly capping the free edge??

I kno you have said you can't accuse her but to me she is definetly picking at her nails!!!

I had a client who was lovely but she kept coming In each week for shellac applied.. She said 'they don't last long cos I pick at them' I can't help it she said.

So I just simply explained that because she is picking her nails it is not my fault that she's needing them redone each week. I said it's too expensive for her to keep getting them done each week, shellac is meant to last 2 weeks.. So why she's tampering with it is just crazy!!!

 

[Victoriabar]

Actually, have a look at that last photo again with the chipped thumb. In the background you can see the tips of the other nails and every one of them has the seal missing, which you can see so clearly in the newly applied picture. I think she is using bleach/household chemicals without gloves and that is eating away at the seal, leading to lumps chipping off, of course....such as the thumb. I bet thats the reason.

Regarding the seal, after a few days I would expect to see no visible seal.
It is only used to serve the purpose of reducing shrink back when applying before getting into the lamp.

With daily movement, getting dressed, touching, picking up items etc we naturally wear away this seal.
When reducing length or neatening up any wear at the very free edge (by filing at 45° tapered downward angle) we leave no seal.

My 16yro daughter has always had very bad peeling nails on fingers and toes, all varnish and gel polishes would lift and peel like the OPs client, we remedied this by buffing the flakes off and used the skill of blending (tips) to totally lose the 'frill' and prime then overlay with UV hard gel but really scrubbing that first very thin layer into the whole nail plate in circular motion to ensure total connection of product and nail plate before curing.
Then following that with another thin (unscrubbed) layer.
After about 10months she had a full beautiful nail plate.

 

[Lucy_Lu]

These clients get me so angry! They expect them to be indestructible and it's always our fault when it's not.

I struggle to hold my tongue with them and usually end up saying something along the lines of "the problem is that the product is not indestructible. The fact that it is lasting 3 days means I have created the necessary bond between your nail and the product and therefore it's something externally that is affecting your treatment. Unfortunately its you who is responsible for your aftercare which includes wearing gloves and using your solar oil. These will ensure you get the full wear out of your treatment"

I only go down this route if it becomes apparent after some trouble shooting that they are telling porky pies. I dont say it to everyone that gets a chip lol. I can't be doing with clients taking the mick so I just don't stand for it. I'd rather not have the client! You have to be assertive with them in my experience.

This without a doubt looks like she's picked!!!

 

[trudy.trudylee]

These clients get me so angry! They expect them to be indestructible and it's always our fault when it's not.

I struggle to hold my tongue with them and usually end up saying something along the lines of "the problem is that the product is not indestructible. The fact that it is lasting 3 days means I have created the necessary bond between your nail and the product and therefore it's something externally that is affecting your treatment. Unfortunately its you who is responsible for your aftercare which includes wearing gloves and using your solar oil. These will ensure you get the full wear out of your treatment"

I only go down this route if it becomes apparent after some trouble shooting that they are telling porky pies. I dont say it to everyone that gets a chip lol. I can't be doing with clients taking the mick so I just don't stand for it. I'd rather not have the client! You have to be assertive with them in my experience.

This without a doubt looks like she's picked!!!

What good advice. I've had a colleague who've I've been practising on that doesn't get on with shellac & don't i know it! But like u say if it lasts at least a few days it isn't what we're doing

 

[Trinity]

I had a similar client, I tried everything, gel, l&p, Polish, strengtheners, Brisa lite, primers, all sorts but just could not solve it. She was great with Solar Oil, and regularly purchased it from me with Almond Hydrating lotion.

In the end in total frustration I said 'enough - let's go back to basics, no products and see what happens'. I did basic manicures, cuticle work, shaping, etc and buffed off as much of the damage as I could, then I simply buffed with a glossing buffer old school style.

Next appointment there was a great improvement, I did the same again maybe 3 or 4 times and now her nails are perfect, all I can believe is her nails just don't like some or one of the chemicals in overlay products. I'm not calling it an allergy as I'm not a doctor but as soon as we stopped all of the problems went away, she and I are both very rrelieved.

Through trial and error we have discovered she can wear polish for 3 days before delamination starts again so saves it for special occasions

 

[aayspa]

Thank you all for your advice and support. It's nice to know I'm not the only one who has that odd problem client.

Sometimes I just wish I could slap her wrists and tell her off for not following her aftercare and then lying to me about it. I swear some clients think we are stupid!x

 

[EmJ]

I'm wondering why her thumb nail looks like it has grown out so much after 3 days? You clearly paint very nearly and close to the cuticles but the picture she's sent looks like it's been on for 10 days!

 

[Mrs Bod]

It always amazes me how many ladies pay good money for quality work and then don't do their bit to maintain them afterwards!

A friend of mine said "why worry when they're happy to keep paying you".

She doesn't get that when you take pride in your work, it's not just about money in your pocket and for me, it's like a little slap round the face with my file when they seem to have more money than sense!

Rant over! Your work is beautiful xx