Cannot get microrings to stay in- help!

[Suki]

Hi Everyone,

I have built my extension buisness up in the last year and it is going very well except for a problem with the micro rings. For the first 9-10 months I did mostly glue and only had one micro ring customer (who seemed to accept that they came out a lot) but in the last couple of months I ran an offer on MR and I have done quite a few as a result.

Problem is virtually every customer contacts me within a few days to a week to say they are falling out so I have ended up spending a huge amount of time travelling about fixing them up for free only to have the same problem a week later again. A couple of my new customers who have had MR elsewhere tell me they didn't have this problem last time. I have just offered to refund a girl half the cost of her extensions because I don't know what else I can do.

I am at my wits end with them and am about to stop offering anything but glue. I have tried the silcone lined micro rings and the non lined copper tubes and have tried two sets of pliers. I don't see how they could be clamped any tighter- what am I doing wrong.

Help!

Thanks

Suki

 

[leonnib]

i do this method now 70% of the time as its very popular
they really shouldnt lose alot of strands tbh but i also had to practise alot before i was comfortable with what i was doing...

1.you really have to make sure your pressing the rings in down securely..its not just pressing it down hard its pressing it in the right way to make sure the ring is secure..
i press it once right in the centre and then at the top and bottom... and i make sure the right part of the pliers are pressing it down as its makes it 'flatter'.. its quite hard to explain but their is a knack to it..
but i find this way works for me and they dont lose any (maybe 2-3 strands)..and i personally dont like the copper micro rings..

2.are you pulling enough of the clients natural hair through the rings as this could cause the rings to slide down also..

 

[lucelasticx]

Hi suki can i ask whether you are a qualified hairdresser please ?

 

[endless]

Hi Suki,
I cant really think of anything else other than what leoni has said, are you sure youre using the right sized tips for the mm of the micro rings?
are youre strands pulling through at the right thickness,and last of all, are the clients hair textures right for micro rings,
I say to every micro ring client that they can have them done, try them and if they do start slipping more than averge, i will glue the hair in for them at the price of a top-up.
Thr fact is that some hairs just arent course or dry enough to hold micro rings.
I would never refund any money to a client,after all theyve had the hair,and my time.
I didnt like micro rings, when i first trained in them, but did it anyway, as it was the new fangled thing, now i love them!!
good luck : )
Kate x

 

[Suki]

Hi

Thanks for your replies. I will try some of the suggestions out.

Leonnib- I use 4 or 5mm rings depending on the thickness of the tips, I don't like the tubes either but a client suggested that they stayed in better so I gave them a go. It tends to be mostly around the sides and the nape off the neck that causes problems which is probably because the hair is thinner there.

Endless- you may have a point about hair texture, the clients I have problems with have all got dark, more naturally oily hair. I recently did an install on a girl with coarser, bleached hair and haven't heard anything from her.

I do advise my clients that their hair type will affect how well the extensions stay in and I also discuss it in the aftercare booklet I give them. The problem is I don't think most of them listen or read the stuff I give them. A lot of clients are loathe even to buy the shampoo or brush that I sell.

I'm going to do a bit more research before I offer them out again.

Thanks

Suki

 

[leonnib]

clients with oily hair generally need maintainence that little quicker tbh.
not a huge difference maybe a week or 2 quicker around 6 weeks approx.

but shouldnt mean losing alot of strands etc.. you might need to make them that little bit more secure for them or pull more hair through then someone with thicker hair so rings dont slide down . hope that makes sense...

ive has clients go on hols or have them in for 3-4 months no maintenence (against my advice) and not lose strands and rings are still secure..
i had a few hiccups when i first started doing them though ...

 

[lucelasticx]

I ask again are you a qualified hairdresser ?

 

[Suki]

Hi lucelasticx

No I am not a qualified hairdresser.

I can see from your other posts that in your eyes I probably fall into the category of '5 min cowgirl' and I fully agree that these people exist as I mop up quite a lot of work from their ex-clients. I also agree that the training courses are not good enough and I would be scared by the idea of someone doing an install a few days later.

I did my course in the summer but did not set up and charge anyone until November, I did a lot of practice installs for free and spent a fair bit of time and money researching and finding good hair and aftercare products, writing my business plan, getting insurance, creating aftercare literature and buying decent kit.

I always tell my clients that I am not an NVQ qualified hairdresser and for that reason I don't do anything other than trim the wispy ends if they require it. I have a good relationship with a large local salon who no longer do extensions themselves and I recommend to my clients that they book in there if they feel they want layers/restyle, my prices are reasonable enough for them to do this and it still be affordable.

I understand the animosity towards us non-qualified's but quite a few of my regulars have not had the greatest experience at some hair salons over the years either. I suspect the issue here is not so much about qualification but the level of care an extensionist has for her clients and the dedication to find solutions and get things right.

I have two clients who are hairdressers themselves and one of them told me that she herself was sent on an extension course by her previous salon but dreaded anyone asking to have them done, the reason being they only ever did a set every 2- 3 months (possibly because of the £500 + charge- I do understand why salons have to charge a lot btw) and because of that she wasn't confident in her ability and didn't always get the bonding quite right.

I do 2-3 heads per week on average now and have got pretty neat at rolling, placement and colour blending. Yes I encounter the odd hiccup (mostly oily haired clients) which I usually resolve, learn from and my clients always come back because I pride myself on great customer service.

Sorry for going a bit off topic but I have read the '5 minute' thread and I know what you are getting at and I just wanted to add a slightly different perspective, I also would like to say that the advice I have had on here has always been excellent and is one of the reasons I can offer a good service as the habia approved extension courses are not good enough in my opinion.

Suki

 

[persianista]

Er Suki, You posted this thread because your ext are dropping out. You are in my opinion, and others, not trained. So please dont kid yourself that your ext are perfect.

If you invest time and money in your career, ie. train as a hairdresser, then finally as an extentionist, then you would realise why EXACTLY you are having these problems.

So I am sorry, I only advise pro hairdressers on this forum.

 

[Suki]

Hi,

I am not trying to say that they are perfect, although I mostly do glue which are imo good and I rarely encounter any problems. Micro Rings are a bit newer to me and it is those that I am finding trickier and I have narrowed that down to a particular hair type.

I just wanted to defend myself against the idea that I am ripping people off, my customers are happy and stay with me, even the ones with teething problems because I care about their hair and I offer a good service, I don't install and run as some do.

Salon Geek has always been a friendly place and I have had some great advice here but I guess if anyone thinks I am not worthy of their time they don't have to reply.

Suki

 

[LeedsGirl]

Hi Suki,

People will always put there 2p in about hairdresser and hair extensions... I was doing my NVQ in hairdressing in a fab salon and they had me train in hair extensions.
I built up private clients with hair extensions outside the salon to gain experience so when qualified I was fairly good...
I had a major car crash halfway through my nvq which has stopped me from persuing me hairdressing career.. but I need to earn money to I have continued with hair extensions as it suits my life I now have to lead!

Maybe someone would like to tell me to stop doing hair extensions??

Anyway.. ur problem.. there is a place called hairextension-shop... they sell sillicon micro rings.. these are good. Maybe go back to your training povider and ask if u could sit in on one of there courses just as a fresher?

Hope this helps x

 

[minky]

I was doing my NVQ in hairdressing in a fab salon and they had me train in hair extensions.

Maybe someone would like to tell me to stop doing hair extensions??

Hello LeedsGirl , if the salon you trained in .... was a Professional hair salon .... and they thought you were up to the Professional standards of doing hair extensions


Then why would there be a reason for you to stop ?

 

[LeedsGirl]

I'm just saying.. I am not a hairdresser as I didn't qualify due to unfortunate circumstances...
I prob wasnt very good then hence I got private clients so when I did qualify I was good to do them in the salon.
I wasn't allowed to perform hair extensions in the salon until I had become qualifed... that day never come but I continued with hair extensions.

My point is.. aslong as your not fobbing people off and are good at the I don't feel there is any problem with just specialising in hair extensions... if there was something wrong habia etc wouldnt accredit those courses.

 

[minky]

I'm just saying.. I am not a hairdresser as I didn't qualify due to unfortunate circumstances...
I prob wasnt very good then hence I got private clients so when I did qualify I was good to do them in the salon.
I wasn't allowed to perform hair extensions in the salon until I had become qualifed... that day never come but I continued with hair extensions.

My point is.. aslong as your not fobbing people off and are good at the I don't feel there is any problem with just specialising in hair extensions... if there was something wrong habia etc wouldnt accredit those courses.

Hi, The Trainer pays out to meet Habias high standards.
Job done....
So Habia don't assess the students ... this becomes the Trainers job ,

but some Trainers are allowing non professionals who have no prior hairdressing knowledge whatsoever on to these very short courses....

and in those few short days the non pro hair /extensionist obtains a certificate plus insurance and is let loose on the unsuspecting public !....

a non pro hair/ extensionist cannot offer the proper cutting and finishing procedures because they will struggle
after only a few days of learning ....
Therefore are not able to finish the job they started .

Don't you think it would have been far better to do it the other way around and get qualified in hairdressing first ?....

Even now .. they could still train up and get the proper hairdressing training , which we think is very necessary....
Otherwise they will always struggle with the cutting and finishing side of things .... minky

 

[SiNfuL GirL]

I just want to tell Suki a great way to stop the slipping from the micro rings is to start using whats called a extend tube.
They are amazing. they have 3 sizes small medium and large. I personally use Small they are 2mm by 1/4 inch. long. you do have to invest in the tool to open them but they work wonders and are well worth the investment.
I Also want to point out that I personally want someone to do my hair who is in term (street smart) other words there heart is into doing either color, cuts, extensions, etc. Reason I have paid high prices to (PROFESSIONALS) who turn my hair (which is platinum blond) Yellow and arent sure how to fix it except apply bleach again. I find that a lot of people just pick a career and go with it because they thought it would be easy and fun when in reality a hair dresser is not as easy as it seems.
Im not bashing anyone only pointing out that for exp. Suki to have a problem and to take the time to ask questions and advise showes her heart is in what she does, extensions. so instead of bashing her because she didint go to school and spend 15-20 grand to learn everything like some and paid to do the part she loves the most and put in her own experiance as well then personally i would rather her do my hair than a cocky hair dresser who probably knows nothing.

I do extensions and i love what i do. i love hair coloring and i hate cutting mens hair so i wont do it. I put my heart in my career and I praise those who do as well along with the ones who want to learn more and take time to figure things out.
​

 

[lucelasticx]

I think California is a little far for you to come and have extensions by Suki eh!!!

I dont feel we are cocky and know nothing on here on here , we are trying to promote a higher standard the ones who are cocky and know nothing are the ones who feel the basics are irrelevant.Learning how to all about hair types is irrelevant is it , same with health and safety i suppose. No 3 day hair extension course can teach you how to operate safely not only in the work place but so you dont have or cause any signifcant problems.
I would like these UNQUALIFIED hair extensionists to have to at least prove that they know ALL the contraidcations they need to know before operating.

Oh and hair extensions is "in my heart" as you say so you know what i did became qualified put my money time and heart where my mouth is!!!!
So you advise all you want but dont expect the rest of us to agree with you!

 

[SiNfuL GirL]

First off I was not pointing fingers in any particular direction (as you assume i did to you via the words you chose in your response)
I didnt say I was going to go to suki to get my extensions done,what I said was I want someone who is willing to learn and whos heart is in the right place (extensions in this case) to do my hair. Yes the business in California is very stiff for competition but like i said previously a TON of girls here do extensions a lot of whom went to school and fail horribly at doing extensions because (THEY CHOSE AN EASY CAREER INSTEAD OF DOING WHAT THEY REALLY WANT) making it harder for those of us who are GOOD at what we do to keep a great name.
The ONLY point I was making is that for someone to come to a forum with a question and who shows they are TRYING to learn as well as getting personal hands on experience and you treat them poorly for not being at a specific standards. (LICENSED STYLIST)
YES it is very important for anyone doing extensions or anything with hair to know the different hair types and lack of hair growth, vitamins, products, the amount they color there hair. Im not disagreeing there but if suki or anyone tells there clients they are not certified stylist then that is the clients choice to stay with them or not. I dont think it is anyones place to set judgment on this forum for another to ask a question to learn more! That is my only point and if you feel you need to take anything else to heart and cry about it then please feel free to ask for a tissue.
Again I didn't point any fingers but a forum is a place to learn and ask questions.

I think California is a little far for you to come and have extensions by Suki eh!!!

I dont feel we are cocky and know nothing on here on here , we are trying to promote a higher standard the ones who are cocky and know nothing are the ones who feel the basics are irrelevant.Learning how to all about hair types is irrelevant is it , same with health and safety i suppose. No 3 day hair extension course can teach you how to operate safely not only in the work place but so you dont have or cause any signifcant problems.
I would like these UNQUALIFIED hair extensionists to have to at least prove that they know ALL the contraidcations they need to know before operating.

Oh and hair extensions is "in my heart" as you say so you know what i did became qualified put my money time and heart where my mouth is!!!!
So you advise all you want but dont expect the rest of us to agree with you!

 

[minky]

i would rather her do my hair than a cocky hair dresser who probably knows nothing.

Cocky hairdressers are never usually seen much on here .....
but what we do see is non professional hair extensionists ..... who have done a short cousre and who want to pick the professional hairdressing extensionists brains....!

I think you are rather cocky to even think that this is ok to happen within our hard earned industry !....

I do extensions . I put my heart in my career and I praise those who do as well along with the ones who want to learn more and take time to figure things out.

And everyone can do this properly by learning hairdressing first!....as set out by Habias training guidelines

​

I would have thought someone like you .... who has trained so hard in hairdressing and extensions for many years like we all have !
would want to protect the hairdressing / extension industry and not just hand it over to 3 day non hair professionals !.....

You did actually come across as rather intelligent in a few of your points but then your own cockiness and rudeness towards other fellow professionals rather let you down ....
what a shame !......

 

[minky]

First off I was not pointing fingers in any particular direction (as you assume i did to you via the words you chose in your response)
I didnt say I was going to go to suki to get my extensions done,what I said was I want someone who is willing to learn and whos heart is in the right place (extensions in this case) to do my hair. Yes the business in California is very stiff for competition but like i said previously a TON of girls here do extensions a lot of whom went to school and fail horribly at doing extensions because (THEY CHOSE AN EASY CAREER INSTEAD OF DOING WHAT THEY REALLY WANT) making it harder for those of us who are GOOD at what we do to keep a great name.
The ONLY point I was making is that for someone to come to a forum with a question and who shows they are TRYING to learn as well as getting personal hands on experience and you treat them poorly for not being at a specific standards. (LICENSED STYLIST)
YES it is very important for anyone doing extensions or anything with hair to know the different hair types and lack of hair growth, vitamins, products, the amount they color there hair. Im not disagreeing there but if suki or anyone tells there clients they are not certified stylist then that is the clients choice to stay with them or not. I dont think it is anyones place to set judgment on this forum for another to ask a question to learn more! That is my only point and if you feel you need to take anything else to heart and cry about it then please feel free to ask for a tissue.
Again I didn't point any fingers but a forum is a place to learn and ask questions.

Hello SiNfuL GirL
I personally don't see how anyone can call themselves a professional hair extensionist if they cannot cut and finish the job they started .....that in itself is not professional !.....

Habia over here who set the professional NVQ standards for our hairdressing and beauty industry ....state that hair extensions are an advanced NVQ unit after level 2
There are some very good private training schools who follow Habias guidelines and will only allow NVQ level 2 or equal to train in Hair extensions

But some will let an unqualified person with no prior hair knowledge at all try and learn hair extensions ..... it's these people will always struggle with the cutting and finishing side of hair extensions....

Hair extensions goes hand in hand with hairdressing and is done after NVQ level 2 or equal .....

A professional hair extensionist would want to cut and finish someone else's hair extensions off for them .....

Therefore ....
The professional knowledge I would give to someone who has done way way less than half a hair course is ..... to go and do a full NVQ2 in college or equal and learn how to cut and finish too !

not just pluck out parts of the hairdressing profession by using short private 3 day courses ..... then come on here asking for professional
help from the ones who have spent many years in training to enable them to a hair extensions course the right way around !.....

The quick route just doesn't work .... you need to at least have some proper hair experience and know how to finish what you started .

I am sure Habia here in the UK didn't set the NVQ hair and beauty guidelines for nothing ... which BTW took many years of hard ongoing work too ! and I for one dont think they should be flouted !.....
minky

 

[SiNfuL GirL]

Mink,
I don't know how you run the business in the UK but In the USA if you get on a forum with a bad attitude like some of these hairdressers and put down others by there words, including twisting innocent words to there advantage is WRONG!
Why do people make forums??????
To Learn?
Im not cocky you misinterpret that with BLUNT. There is no reason for me to sit here and sugar coat the way i feel about how some get treated (poorly for asking a question).
I AGREE 100% you should go to school and learn everything about cosmetology. HOWEVER, when I personally got into hair it was extensions. I started on myself then some close friends who are willing to be my guinea pigs and fell in love. I always loved doing hair but that is what pushed me to actually pursue to get my license. Times are tough these days in the USA and in the UK not everyone has the money to throw down for school but for those who continue to pursue there passion with ANYTHING including extensions or hair i support 200%.
The way innocent members are treated on this forum blows me away. My husband runs a veryyyyy popular forum and they ask what we call NOOBIE questions allllllll the time things that have already been answered 100 times but if we put people down the way you do here we wouldn't have an amazing forum like we do.
Think back what made you want to start doing hair in the first place? Think if your teachers told you that you were stupid and needed to go to pre school before going to school. You would feel like CRAP! So my WHOLE point this ENTIRE TIME is to be careful the way you talk to people there are humans on the other end of that keyboard.
P.S. By the time i went to school I was way ahead of the rest of my class from self taught and self experience. But i never rubbed my knowledge in any ones face, So why would you allow those to put others down for wanting to learn?
Thank you.