My Whole World Has turned Into A Night Mare Please Help

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Good for you jenny ...stand your ground and don't let him grind you down.
Good luck with the new venture and keep us posted.xxxx
 
You're a fab therapist Jen, (I know that as fact as in seen it with my own eyes). So, you've made your decision and I'm sure that you feel much happier in yourself now which is the most important thing.

Well done for giving the salon a try and like the old saying 'What don't kill ya will only make you stronger'.

Good luck with your home salon and I've got a feeling that you'll make all your lost money back and much more in no time at all. Keep your chin up girl. xx:hug:
 
Hi Jenny,
I know you have had a lot of support already, but I am training to be a barrister (my mobile business is paying for this!) so if I can be of any use, let me know. You can email me directly at [email protected] anytime, and I will get back to you with regards to your legal position.
It is very difficult to know what has been proposed in your 'verbal contract', so you would have to let me know in more detail about the 'terms' for me to be able to advise you fully.
I see that some of the geeks state that verbal agreements are not binding. This is not true. A verbal contract carries as much weight as a written contract. Although there will always be a "he said, she said" about the exact terms, a court would easily emerge with implied terms- (ie. what the verbal contract was trying to accomplish, and what terms are likely to have been drawn to achieve this).
Unfortunately, by handing over a 'bond', you have accepted, and entered into the proposed contract, so you are bound by it.
People may suggest for you to deny all knowledge of the contract...My advice is to not go down this road... The courts are not naive. They deal with this kind of matter on a daily basis.

Why is this guy trying to get another month's rent from you? was this part of your contact? Under the Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977, he can not do this. If you would like a draft letter stating this, I will do that for you.
What I would say, is that if you have decided you do not want to go back there, and you can afford to learn (an expensive) lesson, then do so. You do NOT have to pay the extra month's rent. If he threatens to take you to court for it- let him. Call his bluff. It will cost him more to put this through a court than you would have paid him in six months. Trust me.
If you would like to try and get your deposit back (and I say this from a strictly non-legal position) you would need to pull some dirty tricks and do some threatening (with regards to tax, insurance etc). Judging by the attitude of these people, unless you have a very hard-faced friend to hand to speak on your behalf, I would leave it. You do not want to be getting into a battle if you are already low.

For other geeks- Please please learn from this. As exciting as it may be to jump into a contract- take a step back. WRITE a contract. It only has to be very simple, and if these matters should arise over a written contract, they are very easily resolved. If Jenny would have had a written contract, I would have been able to wriggle out of it somehow, and get her money back from her deposit.
Please dont fall into this trap.

Jenny, if you (or anyone else) needs any advice, email me, and I will have a look.

Good luck,
Kerry-Ann xxx
 
He sounds like a total bully. If you really dont want to go back. Get all your stuff when he's not about, keep hold of the key though and if you hear from him tell him you are taking him to court. He cant get anymore money out of you, he owes you your bond back. Get a sol to do a letter stating that (it might cost you a little bit for a letter) and dont have any contact with him again face to face, or over the phone. Unless you are ok in losing your deposit and just accepting it as a learning curve (which I'm in no way saying you should, its yours !), but if you just want to see the back end of this tosser then do that. Dont worry and flap, he is simply not worth it. Total control freak xxxx
 
Surely he could just then say well actually I had a "verbal" agreement for a year. There were no witnesses to this verbal contract. He could state he said whatever and keep bullying her. Mind you, legalities are downright unfair these days. Contrary to what I put above, I would just go if I didnt have the money to fight it, unless of course you are eligible for legal aid perhaps ??? I agree with perhaps using a bit of dirty tactics re tax etc. Best of luck, keep us informed. xx
 
I only read the first 4 posts, so sorry if I'm pulling open doors...

here, an oral contract has no value on a court.
it would be your word against his, right?

then who is right, who is wrong...?

if you have stuff in there, and can proove you bought them (always usefull if the court issue isnt solved) you should ask them back, or ask for a time to go and pick them back.

these are for the facts.
for the rest sweetie... I remember your past issues with staff... too bad it didn't sort out, but it's cool you could find a solution and go mobile. when your back is back (lol) to its normal strength, I'd still suggest you to open your own little something, learning from what went wrong this time. not hiring staff but renting a table for instance.

you'll know how hard it is to go mobile, and the time you lose at the end of the day.

You're young, don't let this ***** bring you down for the rest of your career.
 
Hi guys, my computer is back on line and my new beauty room has had its first lick of paint ready for my first client on thursday.
Thank you so much for your messages, if i am honest i have tried to just shut off from what has happened at the shop because it has drove me mad.
I have got my stuff back from the shop and have not heard from him since our last conversation when he then wanted electric money.
In regards to my bond, no i could not afford to loose it and could do with it now, i was hoping to by some vertical blinds for my new treatment room but am having to make do with curtains untill i can get some more mony.

On the legal side of things any help would be much appretiated and if there was a way i could get my bond back i would be in seventh heaven. Yes this guy is a bully, but his words are this is not personal only business.

In regards to what was said when i initially took the rent of the room on was as follows

1. The rent was set at two hundred pound a month

2. The bond was one month rent ie 200 both to be paid in advance of taking the shop on

3. The contract was for a three month period and depending on how i got on in the shop would have depended on wether i took it on over a longer time at re newal

4. No mention of how much notice was said in regards to leaving. Only that i was to be there for three months nothing else.

5.. He told me at the start the electric was on a seperate meater to the rest of the shop, and because he had had problems in the past regarding how much the bill was, he said lets call it 50 a month and see how we go

6.. I said to him with it being on a seperate metre could he not just transfer it into my name and i will pay for it through my business account. He said lets just call it 50 and then you no were you are.

7. He told me his staff would make appointments for me

that was it nothing more was said. I paid the deposit and bond, moved in and asked when i was going to get the contract. Two weeks if that in the women who has a child with him said she wanted to buy ian out and rent the premises around the corner and she wanted me to go with her.

Ian new all about this, she placed a deposit on the building and asked me to pay three quatres of the rent they would be paying as they had to do work and they would have taxes to pay and so fourth.

She also wanted me to go into a fixed contract so they could rely on that money every month. They talked about getting nail techs in, chiropodists, sports massage therapists all of which would pay them, all of which could have effected my business.

They said my room looked clutered and i would be better with just my couch in there and the rest in the store room, I had one vase, my nail desk, polishes on display, my couch and trolly , wax heaters and pictures that was it.
They told me my carpet was filthy, even though ihoovered at the end of every day, but said that is should not take that personally they only trying to help, they underminded me in front of clients , but in the next breath we hope you do well, they refered to what the previouse therapist around the corner that was in the room i was in, and said "you have a client coming to u to try u, but she usually goes to the one's around the corner, and she uses a knife on the feet, and what do u use because if you do not do a good enough job she will go back to them, oh and we are only trying to help not critise" hello was i going mad

Then they convinced me not to do nail extensions as it took me two hours may be an hour and half when i rushed, but then asked if they could buy my stuff and they would pay me to teach them how to do nails. Omg

So in the end enough was enough, ian has kept my bond, excepted he will not get another months rent but now wants electric, but i have not heard anything from him since the weekend. basically it one big mess and i lost allot of money, yeah i no with time i will get it back, but my deposit gone and he wants more.

hope that all makes sence and maybe a little clearer for you guys, the rest of what happened is already in htis thread some were, first page i think

love jenny
 
Hi Jen,

I think that Kerry Ann had the best advice of all, yes it's a hard lesson (I know because I am going through a disagreement with my landlord, although nothing like yours).

You could try to contact your local small business adviser or business link, they may be able to offer some help. Best of luck with your new home/mobile business. Just think you will be a free agent, less stress ok so you may be a little less well off financially to start with but you can do it,

regards Andi:hug:
 
The way I read all this is that you may be liable for the electric bill, if he does write to you asking for the £50 electric I would write back stating that you are willing to pay the bill but as it is tax deductible you must have a copy of the actual bill for your accounts.
If he phones you about this, tell him that you really must insist in having this in writing because you need to have it all written down for your accounts so that you can of set it against your tax bill.
Be firm but polite on this verbal cuts no ice with the tax man.
If he does send you a copy of the bill before you pay it, contact the energy provider to make sure it really is a seperate meter just for your room.
If it is not then again do not argue with him, work out with the energy supplier what your percentage of the bill is and then pay this to the energy provider and send him the receipt with a covering letter explaining what you have done and why, send it recorded delivery and keep a copy for yourself.
I suspect however that once you start talking about accounts and tax deductible that he will back of because he will not have declared that you have been renting from him. The tax laws have changed and even though you are self employed the person you are renting from is liable for your contributions the same as if you were his employee. Do a search on here, someone got stung this year for over £9000 in contributions.
Good luck with your new studio and rather then thinking you have lost your bond think of it as paying a finders fee for the 50 clients you have picked up which would have cost you a lot more to gain through normal advertising:hug:
 
Hi Jen,

Sorry to hear about your situation. The first step is to document everything your remember including the date and whether someone else was present during any communication.

A verbal agreement is legally binding. However if you go to court it would be your word against his, but I am sure you have supporting evidence to prove your claim.

I read trade magazines and there is a gentleman by the name of David Wright who writes a regular for the magazines on employment and contracts. He maybe able to shed some light. If not I am sure he will be able to point you in the right direction. The website is David Wright Personnel Home

This is business and you should embrace this opportunity as a major learning curve. Put everything in writing, don't waste your time talking to him over the phone especially since he has demonstrated that he is unreasonable!

You're doing great and good luck.
 
URRRRRGH..... messy.....

Thanks for the PM. I'm looking into it for you. I think I may be able to get you your bond back, but don't hold your breath.. all you can do now is put up a fight, aim to get nothing, whatever you do get will be a bonus. I strongly disagree with the electric situation, and I am confident we can get out of that one. As for the bond- like i say, keep an open mind..

I wil draft you a letter tonight, PM me your personal email address and I will send it as a word document. Don't speak to him on the phone- request all correspondence in writing.

Keep smiling

Kerry-Ann.
 
This is a long one, but thought I would copy everyone in on the letter I drafted for Jenny- fingers crossed guys.

Dear ………………………………..
I am writing with regards to our ongoing dispute concerning my lease of your business premises.
Firstly, I would like to bring to your attention to The Code for Leasing Business Premises in England and Wales 2007. I am sure you are familiar with this legislation, but I would like to draw your attention in the first instance to S.1 of the code, which states:
Landlords must make offers in writing, which clearly state: the rent;
the length of the term and any break rights; whether or not tenants
will have security of tenure; the rent review arrangements; rights to
assign, sublet and share the premises; repairing obligations; and the
VAT status of the premises.

As you may recall, your offer was not made in writing, and you may therefore find yourself in breech of this code.
In the second instance, I would like to bring to your attention S.6 of The Code for Leasing Business Premises in England and Wales 2007. Section 6 states:
Landlords must, during negotiations, provide best estimates of service
charges, insurance payments and any other outgoings that tenants
will incur under their leases.
Landlords must disclose known irregular events that would have
a significant impact on the amount of future service charges.
Landlords should be aware of the RICS 2006 Code of Practice on
Service Charges in Commercial Property and seek to observe its
guidance in drafting new leases and on renewals (even if granted
before that Code is effective).

I would like to bring to your attention at this point to the particularly high tariff you was charging me for the use of electricity. I do not feel that this amount was 'fair' or 'reasonable', and as you are now requesting another payment for electricity, I am afraid I will have to insist upon a full breakdown of the amount of electricity used in my premises over the time I was in occupancy. I have been asked to gather this information in writing by my accountant. Please provide me with the relevant receipts within 14 days.

With regards to the deposit I paid (of £200)
You may (or may not) be aware that a land lord is only entitled to keep a deposit if they can show that they have lost out financially because of the tenants actions- either because of damaged property, or unpaid rent.
As I am up to date with rental payments, and have not damaged the property, you have not incurred any loss of earnings by my actions, and are therefore not entitled to keep the deposit.
I am also concerned that I should have been notified -within 14 days of paying my deposit- of which Deposit Protection Scheme you are using. This information would have outlined what to do if there is a dispute about the deposit.
Now that the 14 days have passed, I am eligible to apply to the county court for an order that you should pay the deposit back. I am also entitled to claim compensation equivalent to three times the value of the deposit paid. This payment must be made within 14 days of the court order (plus interest at a fair rate)
I therefore request you forward a cheque made payable to myself for £200 to the above address along with a breakdown of the costs incurred for the use of electricity. Once I have received this information, and I have had it checked, I will forward any payment I may owe for the electricity.
I respectfully request that any further correspondence should be made formally, in writing.

Regards

……………….name…………………

……………..signiture………………….
 
This is a long one, but thought I would copy everyone in on the letter I drafted for Jenny- fingers crossed guys.

Dear ………………………………..
I am writing with regards to our ongoing dispute concerning my lease of your business premises.
Firstly, I would like to bring to your attention to The Code for Leasing Business Premises in England and Wales 2007. I am sure you are familiar with this legislation, but I would like to draw your attention in the first instance to S.1 of the code, which states:
Landlords must make offers in writing, which clearly state: the rent;
the length of the term and any break rights; whether or not tenants
will have security of tenure; the rent review arrangements; rights to
assign, sublet and share the premises; repairing obligations; and the
VAT status of the premises.

As you may recall, your offer was not made in writing, and you may therefore find yourself in breech of this code.
In the second instance, I would like to bring to your attention S.6 of The Code for Leasing Business Premises in England and Wales 2007. Section 6 states:
Landlords must, during negotiations, provide best estimates of service
charges, insurance payments and any other outgoings that tenants
will incur under their leases.
Landlords must disclose known irregular events that would have
a significant impact on the amount of future service charges.
Landlords should be aware of the RICS 2006 Code of Practice on
Service Charges in Commercial Property and seek to observe its
guidance in drafting new leases and on renewals (even if granted
before that Code is effective).

I would like to bring to your attention at this point to the particularly high tariff you was (were) charging me for the use of electricity. I do not feel that this amount was 'fair' or 'reasonable', and as you are now requesting another payment for electricity, I am afraid I will have to insist upon a full breakdown of the amount of electricity used in my premises over the time I was in occupancy. I have been asked to gather this information in writing by my accountant. Please provide me with the relevant receipts within 14 days.

With regards to the deposit I paid (of £200)
You may (or may not) be aware that a land lord is only entitled to keep a deposit if they can show that they have lost out financially because of the tenants actions- either because of damaged property, or unpaid rent.
As I am up to date with rental payments, and have not damaged the property, you have not incurred any loss of earnings by my actions, and are therefore not entitled to keep the deposit.
I am also concerned that I should have been notified -within 14 days of paying my deposit- of which Deposit Protection Scheme you are using. This information would have outlined what to do if there is a dispute about the deposit.
Now that the 14 days have passed, I am eligible to apply to the county court for an order that you should pay the deposit back. I am also entitled to claim compensation equivalent to three times the value of the deposit paid. This payment must be made within 14 days of the court order (plus interest at a fair rate)
I therefore request you forward a cheque made payable to myself for £200 to the above address along with a breakdown of the costs incurred for the use of electricity. Once I have received this information, and I have had it checked, I will forward any payment I may owe for the electricity.
I respectfully request that any further correspondence should be made formally, in writing.

Regards

……………….name…………………

……………..signiture(signature)………………….

Hiya :)

I have been reading this thread with much interest and I would like to give a big :hug: to Jen.

Kerry, this letter is fantastic and THANK YOU for placing in the public domain, I'm sure it will help many others long after this has been settled. I hope you don't mind but I have highlighted a couple of spelling and grammatical errors as I feel a letter of this seriousness and weight should be free of mistakes.

Thanks again and I hope everything gets sorted out (in Jen's favour obviously!)

Sarah. xx
 
ha ha. thanks. it's copy&paste'd, so it's not set out in this way in word format, but I guess you all get the jist... Hopefully it will help. GO JEN!! x:green:
 
Thanks Kerry Anne, I have to agree this letter is brilliant, clear concise and very to point without being rude. Good luck Jen I hope you clear this matter up once and for all please let us know the outcome.:hug:
 
Thank you so much, wish me look guys sending this letter i am scared that i end up in more of a mess as i have not heard from him since our last telephone conversation and at the back of my mind no news is good news
love jenny
 
also, with us saying that i would take the room on for three months, even though nothing was said about notice or anything like that, would i be liable for the other two months rent as i only paid for one month in advance and my deposit all of which i have receipts for. Sorry just need to check before i post the letter so i am amared with advise xxxx
 
Really- yes, you should have to pay the three months, BUT he should have used the deposit scheme, and you should have been informed of this within 14 days... This is a major loop-hole, which makes your contract void. I wouldn't take this all the way to court, it isn't worth your worry, but by threatening him with the possible £600 plus compensation and interest, you MAY get your deposit back. If not, at least you will have scared him out of asking you for your electricity money, or bullying you in any other way.
The main thing is- he can't take YOU to court for anything, so you can't get in 'too deep'- your just fighting for what is rightfully yours.
xxx
 
Thank you kerry ann, i shall post this letter today, fingers crossed it works:hug:xx
 
im not trying to be a know-it-all,
but for gods sake give this person NOTHING! he doesnt even deserve the time of day!
the things you have documented that they have said and done are beyond belief, no employer (especially a ligitamate one!) would say anyof those things!!!
why would one room in a premises be on a seperate meter? hes just trying to rinse you!
then they are trying to claim all your equipment and get free tutoring from you!!! lol!!!
pleaseeeeeeeeee dont waste another minute on this person, give him nothing, and know for a fact you owe him nothing!!!!
oral contract? aint worth the paper its written on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
lmao
be strong hun and get on with your career xxxxxx
 

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