acne rosacea

[ren40]

Hi!
Anyone out there familiar with acne rosacea? i have a client coming to me next week and she has Acne rosacea - I use Dermalogica and am divided between treating her with Environmental Face Treatment or medicated clearing treatment!

would love to have any views you may have!!

thanks!!

 

[weezie]

I don't know Dermalogica but with acne rosacea the skin can become very sensitive and reactive so it would be advisable to do a calming/soothing facial if any.:hug: The environmental face treatment sounds right, what does it involve?

 

[VHunter]

I suffer Acne-Rosacea.

Basically, anything that is meant to moisturize dry irritated skin, will cause an acne breakout.
And anything meant to treat Acne, will cause a Rosacea flare-up (redness, burning & itching).

It's NOT fun and even dermatologists have a most difficult time treating it.
You'd be best using products meant for hypersensitive/allergy prone skin.

Here's some links to help you learn more about it.
Rosacea.org: The National Rosacea Society
Rosacea Basics: What is Rosacea?

hth's

 

[beautynails]

Have a look through your Dermalogica book. It's a while since I trained with them, but I'm sure that we did go through the appropriate products to use on a client with rosacea. Enzyme treatments are the best exfolliation method. Dermalogica would have a help line you could ring.........give them a call and discuss it with them. You really don't want to go aggrivating your clients skin.

 

[kelly!!]

hi

i use dermalogica and i would use medicated clearing as its for acne as they may be something in the enviro cleanser that may cause a reaction to the acne but some good advice i would also phone your local rep/helpline just to make sure

 

[VHunter]

OH, just remembered:

FYI: alph-hydroxy acids are also very irritating to Rosacea.

And I found a list for you of ingredients to avoid:

When Blushing is Not by Choice: Causes and Treatments for Rosacea

Ingredients to Avoid
While it is almost impossible to list all of the ingredients that can potentially trigger reactions for those with rosacea, the following is a good general list to consider. Keep in mind that not everyone reacts the same to any of these elements:

• Acetone
• Alcohol or SD alcohol followed by a number (Ingredients like cetyl alcohol or stearyl alcohol are standard, benign, waxlike cosmetic thickening agents and are completely nonirritating.)
• Ammonia
• Arnica
• Ascorbic acid
• Balm mint
• Balsam
• Bentonite
• Benzalkonium chloride
• Bergamot
• Camphor
• Chamomile
• Cinnamon
• Citrus juices and oils (such as grapefruit or orange)
• Clove
• Clover blossom
• Cocoa butter
• Coriander
• Cornstarch
• Eucalyptus
• Fennel
• Fennel oil

• Fir needle
• Fragrances of any kind
• Geranium
• Horsetail
• Lavender
• Lemon
• Lemongrass
• Lime
• Marjoram
• Melissa
• Menthol
• Mint
• Oak bark
• Papaya
• Peppermint
• Phenol
• Sandalwood oil
• SD alcohol, ethanol alcohol or isopropyl alcohol
• Sodium C14-16 olefin sulfate
• Sodium lauryl sulfate
• TEA-lauryl sulfate
• Thyme
• Wintergreen
• Witch hazel
• Ylang-ylang

Hth's
:hug:

 

[beautyseeker]

So Val, basically everything?

You poor girl hope you have managed to find something that helps you.

:hug::hug:

 

[VHunter]

It's "Victoria":lol:

(why does EVERYONE say Val? LOL)

Yup, just about everything.
Either
A) it causes an acne flare-up (yuck, no one likes looking like a 13yr old)
or
B) it aggravates the Rosacea and becomes redder than usual, itchy and burns.
:cry:

As far as cleansers go, the things that work best are ph balanced and target over-sensitive skin.
ABSOLUTELY NO products meant for treating acne.
Acne and "Acne Rosacea" are VERY different in terms of treatment.

Cleansers I have found that do not irritate, are:
Dove Soap unscented
Cetaphil
Spectrogel
Neutrogena

Everything else has either given me pimples or set my face on fire.
I have not found a single toner that doesn't irritate.
As for makeup.... waiting for my mineral makeup in the mail, to see how that goes.

For moisturizers, I skip it.
Everything to date has caused pimples (and I have spent a FORTUNE trying all that I can find, spoken to pharmacists, dermatologists, estheticians....)
I'd rather have dry skin, instead of looking like a pepperoni pizza:irked:

 

[lilacm]

I have some clients with acne rosacea and they use the sheer tint redness relief. Its excellent and calms the skin while providing some cover. I would do the environmental control facial but customise it a bit when you see the client. You should be fine with ultracalming cleanser and soothing protection spray.

If you phone the Dermalogica helpline they will be able to give you some more hints i'm sure.

 

[Nicki-Marie]

Sorry to Hijack .. Ive just trained with Md Formulations and they have specialised peels to help with acne rosacea .. Im yet to do further training in may to cover this. But im just curious as to the comments above about AHA's being avoided. As Far as I was aware Glycolic and salicylic can be used for this condition. Although treatment time is kept low. Am I completely off the mark here?

 

[VHunter]

In my personal experience, and according to 2 of the dermatologists that I have had, those ingredients are to be AVOIDED.

They irritated my skin greatly and my face flamed bright lobster red and burned and itched.
Good for acne, BAD for rosacea.

 

[Nicki-Marie]

As I said im yet to find out more on this when I complete the training. Be quite interesting, I have a few new questions to ask the trainer.

Glycolic is found naturally in our bodies anyway in the skin, blood and liver its a natural ingredient from sugar cane.

What did you use that irritated you victoria?

 

[VHunter]

What did you use that irritated you victoria?

I have used SOOOOOOOOOOOO many different products under the sun, over the years.
It's MUCH easier to remember what DOESN'T irritate my skin, one way or the other.
And that list is pretty much the cleansers mentioned above.
Anything I have tried that has aha's etc.... has irratated my skin, terribly.

That, and the 'dermabrasion' scrub from the Avon Anew line.

YES, it's not professional etc... but I try everything I can to see what works and what doesn't.
So far, what 'does' isn't much.:cry:

 

[essentia]

Hi This is a really interesting subject. I believe you can use AHA's. Nimue use a much gentler form for their interactive (includes sensitised and sick skins) range polyhydroxy acids which gently exfoliate, hydrate and provide barrier protection. There are varied theories for rosacea from bacterial infection to sun damage etc. But what is interesting is that it mainly affects 30 -60 year olds. Skin starts to thin around this age and its previous treatment therefore may be a causative factor. AHA's can increase the thickness of the epidermis by 25% in 8 weeks and give a 30% increase in the dermis in 28 weeks which is maybe why it has been indicated.

 

[bexi]

i am dermalogica trained, i would do a medicated clearing treatment, this is for acne, which is very different to acne rosacea.

Becki xxx

oooooh also daily microfoliant is fanatstic for these types of clients, I have had a lot of success with it!

 

[pure]

Well at college we were taught to treat as a sensitive skin, not acne. Therefor a gentle aha exfoliator rather than a granular one. Victoria it's very interesting to hear your experiences of it because it seems to go against what we, as skin care specialist, are being taught.

What did you dermatologist advise for exfoliation then?

 

[VHunter]

Well at college we were taught to treat as a sensitive skin, not acne. Therefor a gentle aha exfoliator rather than a granular one. Victoria it's very interesting to hear your experiences of it because it seems to go against what we, as skin care specialist, are being taught.

What did you dermatologist advise for exfoliation then?

Nothing but my bare hands, and my cleanser.
Not even a face-cloth.
WHICH drives me MAD.
Hence why I tried the Anew Dermabrasion and a few others.
I figured if I only did it 2-3 times a week, it would be less harsh than scrubbing my face daily.
So far, so good. It's a month now.

Have also tried 2 new creams for moisturizing that target rosacea sufferers...
guess what?
They made me break out
:cry:

 

[ren40]

Thank you everyone!!
have I opened a 'can of worms'!!!! I am a little confused!!! but my initialm instinct was to go for the Environmental facial - which uses caling products - UC cleanser sootihng protection barrier repair - and I thought Daily Microfolient for exfoliater! I doing a refresher at Cambridge in April so this will be my big queston for them - I am tring to get hold of the 'help desk' there to ask a trainer but in the meantime if anyone has any more info it is greatly received! - as I am new to the Geek - I'm 'learning how to navigate this aswell - so bare with me!! thank you again
ren40

 

[huberella]

Hi!
Anyone out there familiar with acne rosacea? i have a client coming to me next week and she has Acne rosacea - I use Dermalogica and am divided between treating her with Environmental Face Treatment or medicated clearing treatment!

would love to have any views you may have!!

thanks!!

No, do not use the acne line for rosacea. You want to use the ultracalming cleanser and soothing booster and barrier repair cream. The medicated stuff will be far too harsh.

 

[ren40]

I have some clients with acne rosacea and they use the sheer tint redness relief. Its excellent and calms the skin while providing some cover. I would do the environmental control facial but customise it a bit when you see the client. You should be fine with ultracalming cleanser and soothing protection spray.

If you phone the Dermalogica helpline they will be able to give you some more hints i'm sure.

Hi!
thannk you for your views! I was thinking the same as you but its reassuring to have it verified by another geek! the helpline you called - is it the training centre? I have just received all my stock and am still a bit 'gree' as to where I need to call for certain info!! thanks for the advice re: sheer tint redness relief. the client coming went to another salon to but some home products and was given daily resurfacer- which she seems to be ok with - I just want to ensure I give her the best and correct treatment and home products now she is coming to me!
cheers again
ren40