Dennis Williams selling Solar Oil, Scrub Fresh, Additives and Nourishing Remover

[nicole333]

I've always accepted and complied (and still do!) regarding where to buy my products, but when the Creative Academy in Ireland broke away I was left quite confused what was being said about them regarding Shellac. I couldn't understand why a company that had built up a fantastic reputation was now being slated etc.

And now more recently Bournemouth breaking away, I mean these people are well respected within our industry and we have built up business relationships with them and we trust them. I cannot and do not believe for one second that they are engaging in underhand importing, it's just not their style. They don't suddenly go dodgy over night do they?

As for DW, I have never dealt with them so cannot comment on them as a company but have read others thoughts on them and this situation.

I think a lot of people are starting to come out of a fog, that is all.

 

[hazeleyes]

I must admit all the breaking away is suspicious- I read all sorts on Facebook some of which is probably gossip and some of which is true! How are creative academy Bournemouth still obtaining and selling shellac??
Very interesting topic... I'm learning a lot! I almost feel stupid for believing some of the hype around this issue. I'm a loyal person but I'm not stupid!!

 

[angelgorg]

I must admit all the breaking away is untrue, I read all sorts on Facebook some of which is probably gossip and some of which is true! How are creative academy Bournemouth still obtaining and selling shellac??
Very interesting topic... I'm learning a lot! I almost feel stupid for believing some of the hype around this issue. I'm a loyal person but I'm not stupid!!

Transparency and truth is too much to ask for it seems in the world of big boy business!
I've certainly learned a lot from reading facebook posts and threads on here that's for sure!

 

[Lynne Baker]

I'm not sure people understand the nature of the relationship between distributor and manufacturer...

 

[JuicyLucy]

I'm not sure people understand the nature of the relationship between distributor and manufacturer...

But what's to understand Lynne? The manufacturers are selling to someone who is then selling on. We all run our own businesses and need to earn a living. If someone else is selling genuine and legal product at a lower price, many people will buy. The savings are significant.

I suspect that something has changed with the law (maybe something to do with the EU), that is affecting "Sole Distributor" rights in the UK??? Either way, if the current distributors want to compete then they will have to lower their prices - simple.

 

[Lynne Baker]

It's to do with contracts and territories.
The contracts I have with my manufacturers (and I cannot comment on those between S2 and CND) is that I won't sell to people outside of my territory, and they won't sell to anyone else within mine, whether trade or retail.

Price is only one factor when choosing a supplier, as well. Many of our customers choose service over price. If that weren't the case there would be no Waitrose/Harrods etc, but I do agree that price is very definitely one of several contributory factors.

 

[CustomerisKing]

My name is Jim Nordstrom. I am a partner with the Sweets at Sweet Squared, co-founder of famous Names (maker of IBX) and co-founder of Creative Nail Design (now CND and CEO there for 19 years). There have been a lot of points introduced in this string that I would like to address.
When we founded Sweet Squared seven years ago from very humble beginnings (meaning the three of us put a lot on the line to start S2), we decided that we would take a different path from many of the other distributors in the UK market. Instead of offering “deals”, we vowed to offer the best education (and lots of it); great customer service; bring the very best products the industry has to offer to the UK; support all of the major trade shows; host our The Event as opportunity presented; create the best and most convenient catalog; promote the CND brand to the UK consumer; and most recently the industry’s best salon locator system. We have never raised price from when a product was initially introduced by us, even though we have absorbed many price increases and the exchange rate has at times moved against us in a big way. Further, and perhaps most importantly, we keep our products professional only. We think this list of services we offer are far more important than offering 5+1 deals.
Finally, Sweet Squared is the one and only authorized CND distributor for the UK market…no one else has that status. We can certify that our products are genuine CND products as we buy directly from CND. No one else in the UK market can make that claim. We are dedicated to supporting the nail professional and work hard on a continuing basis to improve how and when we can support you the professional. We are long term thinkers and hope you join us in that growth path…

 

[JuicyLucy]

It's to do with contracts and territories.
The contracts I have with my manufacturers (and I cannot comment on those between S2 and CND) is that I won't sell to people outside of my territory, and they won't sell to anyone else within mine, whether trade or retail.

Price is only one factor when choosing a supplier, as well. Many of our customers choose service over price. If that weren't the case there would be no Waitrose/Harrods etc, but I do agree that price is very definitely one of several contributory factors.

I understand what you are saying. However, Waitrose and Harrods do not sell the same products as Tesco or Debenhams at a higher price. Where they sell the same products they are competitively priced. In fact Waitrose will price match any supermarket if its the same item. Waitrose and Harrods seem more expensive because they sell many higher quality brands that you might not find elsewhere.

With distributors we are talking about the same products not the difference between a cheap brand and an expensive brand.

 

[Florry]

DW seem to have the discontinued colours in stock - how is that??

 

[DuyguKasapoglu]

My name is Jim Nordstrom. I am a partner with the Sweets at Sweet Squared, co-founder of famous Names (maker of IBX) and co-founder of Creative Nail Design (now CND and CEO there for 19 years). There have been a lot of points introduced in this string that I would like to address.
When we founded Sweet Squared seven years ago from very humble beginnings (meaning the three of us put a lot on the line to start S2), we decided that we would take a different path from many of the other distributors in the UK market. Instead of offering “deals”, we vowed to offer the best education (and lots of it); great customer service; bring the very best products the industry has to offer to the UK; support all of the major trade shows; host our The Event as opportunity presented; create the best and most convenient catalog; promote the CND brand to the UK consumer; and most recently the industry’s best salon locator system. We have never raised price from when a product was initially introduced by us, even though we have absorbed many price increases and the exchange rate has at times moved against us in a big way. Further, and perhaps most importantly, we keep our products professional only. We think this list of services we offer are far more important than offering 5+1 deals.
Finally, Sweet Squared is the one and only authorized CND distributor for the UK market…no one else has that status. We can certify that our products are genuine CND products as we buy directly from CND. No one else in the UK market can make that claim. We are dedicated to supporting the nail professional and work hard on a continuing basis to improve how and when we can support you the professional. We are long term thinkers and hope you join us in that growth path…

S2 sell to the public at trade shows, or used to! Why are you still trying to imply that DW products aren't genuine when EVERYONE knows they are - do you think they'd be still selling them if they weren't?!

 

[MrsHBeauty]

You say EVERYONE knows they are genuine - but how do we know? I have only ever bought from s2 or Ellisons so don't know for sure the DW is genuine.

But I haven't leaner a lot from this thread and it definitely raises suspicions and has made me think twice about what I read and believe.

 

[Pen09]

I shall continue to buy from S2 they have really helped myself and my business to grow. I've had endless advice from them and I'm lucky enough to be able to go to S2 shop as I don't live too far from it. The staff are fantastic and extremely friendly. I aren't saying that DW aren't, all I am saying is that I personally would prefer to buy from an authorised seller of CND X

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[The Geek]

No one is saying they are not genuine, what CND and S2 are saying is... Neither of us knows. Maybe it's all real, maybe they are mostly real. Maybe some are recalls, maybe others discontinued or expired. Bottom line is, no one knows (I doubt they do).

Those who get their information from Facebook feeds and from gossip, will only ever have part of the story. That is because we generally don't comment on these matters as we find it unprofessional.

Many of you know what it is like to have a high volume, budget salon open up down the road from you, trying to undercut your services and take your customers. You may find it hard with some customers to explain the challenges and costs that are factored into your pricing. You invest in your education, hygiene, and advertising while they may not.

Our situation has some similarities. We invest A LOT into education, marketing, advertising, brand building, consumer pr, events, trade shows, etc... Of course it's easy to undercut us when you can buy from suspect sources and not spend a penny investing into any of the program's we do building the brand and supporting the industry. Just like a lot of your customers could save a fortune by going to a budget salon that doesn't invest in the same things you do.

There is a very serious diversion issue in the UK. It is damaging all of the companies that invest in the industry, not just S2. You obviously have to decide what is more important to you as a professional: support those that support and invest in the industry or shave 20 pence off your application costs supporting companies that feed off others investment and happily sell to just about anyone. If everyone were to do this, there simply wouldn't be a professional industry.

In the end, ask yourself what is the real price of cheap? And get informed as to how much that really saves you in your business.

 

[Selina]

Would not be surprised if there is an increase in threads started over the next while with people complaining they are suddenly experiencing service breakdown issues/clients nails not lasting how they used to. If there is a sudden surge of people buying possibly old out of shelf life, recalled etc. "genuine" products, the old saying of buy cheap, pay twice springs to mind. Personally, I will stick to what I know is what it should be and will be remaining with S2.

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[mum]

That is a very interesting analogy from The Geek! And one that should resonate with many following this thread!

How many posts have you seen here and on FB of people wailing about cut price salons? You know the ones? Low salaries, cheap products, lack of salon hygiene, poor staff training. What has always been the answer? Concentrate on your own business values and educate your clients. Accept that there will always be clients who will buy cheap whatever the quality. (BTW I am not comparing any wholesalers with cut price salons! Just the analogy of the cheaper options)

Now, I have no issue with healthy competition and everyone should have their own freedom of choice where they buy and if saving a few pence is important to them (after all it is a bargain! Isn't it?)

So DW has been selling Shellac (and Gelish incidentally) for a while that is almost certainly genuine as there is a big diversion problem that seems to be tricky to stop. But this is someone somewhere back along the sales route, breaking a legal contract. Interestingly, DW is only just advertising Scrubfresh and Solar Oil as 'NEW IN'. Using 'systems' and following manufacturers instructions is key to providing effective and safe services for clients. That is how important the customers of the 'diverters' view YOUR business! They don't! They are just interested in offering products a bit cheaper than a competitor.

So now you all have choices where to buy your professional products. That's your choice to make and that's potentially good commercial business. But it is like the difference of going to John Lewis where every single sales person knows every single product in their dept and have been trained by every manufacturer. They are able to give very good, unbiased advise with a vast amount of knowledge (that always amazes me). Or you can go to a store where you have to search for a sales assistant who then has no,idea what you are asking for, where it is, what is does and how it's different from another brand.

It's your choice!

 

[jacquelineanna]

That is a very interesting analogy from The Geek! And one that should resonate with many following this thread!

How many posts have you seen here and on FB of people wailing about cut price salons? You know the ones? Low salaries, cheap products, lack of salon hygiene, poor staff training. What has always been the answer? Concentrate on your own business values and educate your clients. Accept that there will always be clients who will buy cheap whatever the quality. QUOTE.

Love this .... this thread is the equivalent of the countless threads referred to above.

The therapists who are going to check out Dennis Williams or any other source which gets their hands on Shellac, with a view to purchasing, might bear in mind that they now have to answer to why their own valued or potential clients are prepared to get their nails/spray tan/hair extensions from the cheap salon down the road.

The analogy is so accurate and clear it should make anyone now able to understand how it can happen. How these cheap salons, hobbyists and You-Tubers can be stealing the business from under your noses.

The therapists who want to go to DW even though no one is quite sure how/where the products are being procured - no problem, you're entitled to get your deal.

The clients who want to go to the cheap salons, with no insurance, who aren't trained, who 'learned' how to do nails/tanning/hair extensions on You Tube - no problem, you're entitled to your deal.

There is no difference between the two.

 

[Flickaroo]

A lot of my clients have 'shellac' on their nails when it is in fact bluesky.
I'm not prepared to use fake or counterfeit products, I am however prepared to buy from another company if they are offering a better price for the same product.
That's business.

 

[Lynne Baker]

And that, my friend, is exactly what your clients could be saying about your business.

 

[Flickaroo]

And that, my friend, is exactly what your clients could be saying about your business.

I'm pretty lucky, there are no salons around me providing shellac for 'cheaper' than me. Just bluesky, like I said, which isn't the same product anyway.

 

[Balance Andover]

As a test of their duty of care to the industry it has just taken me two minutes to open a trade account with the company in question.

I've not been asked for proof of qualifications, I just had to tick a box to say I was a qualified beauty therapist or hairdresser.

If that isn't enough to boycott, I don't know what is! suffice to say I won't be using them as they are happy to sell to anyone.