Thinking of swapping Shellac for Gelish

[happyfeet]

As I've said before, this is where it gets interesting. Gelish says you can, Shellac says you can't. Which is right? I've used Shellac color with Gelish base and top on myself and it works fine (w/CND UV lamp only) - it's consistent with one manufacturer's instructions, but at odds with another. Intermixing is another one of those hot issues (like the lamp issue) that manufacturers and techs will be navigating over the next couple of years.

I think thats the point though- its only one manufacturer okaying it not both. I personally think its highly irresponsible of one supplier to say its ok without, it seems to me the back up of research, knowledge and product capabilities. I also would hazard a guess if there was a problem due to the mixing of systems, insurance companies would say over to you (meaning the techs). Shellac was designed as a whole system from base coat, to colour coats to top coat (remember hunky chads video ) i think harmony as muddying the waters here. As amelia says shellac is a power polish- a uv colour coat system, where as gelish is a gel.

Not directing this at you lovey just in answer to your post x x x

 

[NancySyd]

I think thats the point though- its only one manufacturer okaying it not both. I personally think its highly irresponsible of one supplier to say its ok without, it seems to me the back up of research, knowledge and product capabilities. I also would hazard a guess if there was a problem due to the mixing of systems, insurance companies would say over to you (meaning the techs). Shellac was designed as a whole system from base coat, to colour coats to top coat (remember hunky chads video ) i think harmony as muddying the waters here. As amelia says shellac is a power polish- a uv colour coat system, where as gelish is a gel.

Not directing this at you lovey just in answer to your post x x x

I don't think it is muddying the waters; it is simply Gelish doing what is right for Gelish. Whether that is right for CND Shellac is for them to decide-although CND Shellac is advertised to consumers, CND is clearly focused solely on the nail professional as its buying market. But I think that Gelish is trying to respond to the demands of its market, a market that includes professionals, clients and DIY, that is concerned about things like intermixing and what lamp to use. And while I respect that CND Shellac wants to distinguish its product in the marketplace, "power polish" is merely a marketing term, it is not a scientific description. Shellac is a type of UV gel polish - a hybrid form of it to be sure, but it is a gel product nonetheless. Shellac contains the ingredients that define a UV gel product and functions as one. That it can be used with other gel products is not surprising.

Now I'm not advocating that people disregard CND's instructions on how to use Shellac. They have carefully defined what constitutes a Shellac mani and it is important to stick to that. However, things are changing. When there were only a couple of brands, the requirements to "stay within the system" and "use only our lamp" made sense. But the power/gel polish market is huge and growing and in the future, there will be a lot of discussion about individual brands and how they interact. It is an interesting and exciting time to be a nail professional.

 

[ChicUnique]

It's quite simple really..... Gelish base and top can be used with other gel polish colours, great.
Shellac Is not a gel polish, so obviously you cannot mix it with gelish base and top.
Personally I would not mix systems, a, I don't really know enough about the science behind how its made etc, fear of undercuring.... But b, it also looks so much more professional to use a whole system rather than bits of this and bits of that.

I do like the idea of offering both, I'm contemplating adding shellac to my collection so my clients have a choice. I have some clients that have wonderfully strong nails, that would suit shellac after all both have their pros and not everybody suits the same thing. X

 

[elmo]

I must admit, colour selection is what swayed me away from shellac to gelish, fab choice of colours from 'safe' to neons, glitters etc so all ages, clients covered. I've never had anyone ask for something I couldn't achieve with gelish. I loooove the stuff x

 

[Jocie]

They are both great products. I myself prefer gelish, but both are equally good. If you have the market for both then go for it. Its a bit of an investment but if you have lots asking for it, it will pay off.

 

[Planky1]

I, personally at the moment, am using Shellac and that is all and currently no plans to stock anything else (although never say never but there is no need for me to stock anything else at the moment). I am natural nail services only and have had a few clients who have actually had their enhancements removed to try and grow their own nails using Shellac and Solar oil to help along the way because they love the product so much.

Whilst Gel polishes perhaps give the added strength to those with very weak or peeling nails, my experience so far, is that even one client I have whose nails were in a shocking state to start with, has now made massive improvements by using Shellac and Solar Oil together. It has been said that some people cannot get on with Shellac due to the condition of their nails but I am yet to have a client that this happens with.

She (as well as all my other clients) certainly has been drawn in by the fact that this power polish requires no buffing of the nail plate and this has been the biggest selling factor for me. I've not had one person ask me to supply a Gel Polish based on extra durability or colour choice. If anything, my clients are spoilt for choice and already find it difficult to choose.

What is your reply to these clients when they say the colours are boring/safe? My reply would be full of enthusiasm and along the lines of "You have got to be kidding, look at all these effects and colours we can make" and I would eagerly show them my colour pops. They then would also feel excited about what can be done with Shellac.

I have a range of colour pops on display, some plain, some with art, some with ombrés, some glitter etc and it gets my clients talking and oo'ing and arr'ing and excited at what they might have at their next appointment.

In fact just last night, my client came clear in mind with what she was going to have done but saw mine, was amazed they had been done with Shellac and asked for the same.

I find Shellac anything other than boring or safe......

 

[happyfeet]

I dont think power polish is a marketing term, to me it distinguishes itself in the market. As i understand shellac is a step up from polish, its applied the same way (including how you pep the nail) but its cured under the cnd uv light so instantly dry and your good to go from the off. So really power polish to me fits that description perfectly- its a polish with umph!

Shellac isnt a type of gel polish at all either, theres no gel in it.

Im going out on a limb here but why would another company advocate using another companies products? Science aside here, and please no one think im rubbishing harmony or other brands, im not im always checking out other products but yet to find one i need (not want lol) to invest in, but really going back to the original question, if gelish have so many colours available and as some have said thats whats swayed their decision, why does anyone need to use colours from one system in another. I know its not as black and white as that i carry mainly cnd polish but have nubar and opi but do you see what i mean? To me it just seems a bit odd. That said what over rides all of this is product chemistry- gelish is a gel polish and simply shellac is not. And further to that is insurance- if we check the fine print of our insurance its more than likely insuring you to use the whole system as per the manufacturers instruction, so you use gelish with a shellac colour, harmony says hey you can use shellac, cnd doesnt.

Love n hugs x x x

 

[NancySyd]

I dont think power polish is a marketing term, to me it distinguishes itself in the market. That's exactly what a marketing term does! But "POWER POLISH' does not say anything scientifically about the product As i understand shellac is a step up from polish, its applied the same way (including how you pep the nail) but its cured under the cnd uv light so instantly dry and your good to go from the off. So really power polish to me fits that description perfectly- its a polish with umph!

Shellac isnt a type of gel polish at all either, theres no gel in it. That is incorrect, Shellac is a hybrid gel polish. Shellac does contain gel and gel ingredients as well as solvents and pigments. Read the MSDS or listen to Jan Arnold's earliest descriptions of Shellac. Perhaps it is more accurate to say Shellac is not just a gel polish, but it is scientifically incorrect to say it is not a gel polish at all.

Im going out on a limb here but why would another company advocate using another companies products? Science aside here, and please no one think im rubbishing harmony or other brands, im not im always checking out other products but yet to find one i need (not want lol) to invest in, but really going back to the original question, if gelish have so many colours available and as some have said thats whats swayed their decision, why does anyone need to use colours from one system in another. I know its not as black and white as that i carry mainly cnd polish but have nubar and opi but do you see what i mean? To me it just seems a bit odd. It is very simple; by allowing other brands to be used with it, Gelish opens up a whole range of colors to its customers. That way, if one sees colors in another brand, one does not have to leave Gelish to use it. Regardless of what you or I may think, the lack of a broad range of colors is one of the perceived major failings of Shellac. Harmony obviously saw that and capitalized on it. That said what over rides all of this is product chemistry- gelish is a gel polish and simply shellac is not. Yes, it is. It just isn't 100% gel. And further to that is insurance- if we check the fine print of our insurance its more than likely insuring you to use the whole system as per the manufacturers instruction, so you use gelish with a shellac colour, harmony says hey you can use shellac, cnd doesnt.

Now I'm not saying that Shellac isn't a great product. It is and our clients love it. But as nail professionals we need to separate the fact from the marketing hype - and companies like CND and OPI and Harmony have a lot of hype going. Shellac is a gel polish, a hybrid gel polish. It is not the only one - Light Elegance P2, IBD Gelac and LeChat Perfect Patch come to mind. Shellac and the others exist on a spectrum from being like regular nail polish to 100% gel - but they are all gel polishes.

Love n hugs x x x

 

[Planky1]

I dont think power polish is a marketing term, to me it distinguishes itself in the market. That's exactly what a marketing term does! But "POWER POLISH' does not say anything scientifically about the product As i understand shellac is a step up from polish, its applied the same way (including how you pep the nail) but its cured under the cnd uv light so instantly dry and your good to go from the off. So really power polish to me fits that description perfectly- its a polish with umph!

Shellac isnt a type of gel polish at all either, theres no gel in it. That is incorrect, Shellac is a hybrid gel polish. Shellac does contain gel and gel ingredients as well as solvents and pigments. Read the MSDS or listen to Jan Arnold's earliest descriptions of Shellac. Perhaps it is more accurate to say Shellac is not just a gel polish, but it is scientifically incorrect to say it is not a gel polish at all.

Im going out on a limb here but why would another company advocate using another companies products? Science aside here, and please no one think im rubbishing harmony or other brands, im not im always checking out other products but yet to find one i need (not want lol) to invest in, but really going back to the original question, if gelish have so many colours available and as some have said thats whats swayed their decision, why does anyone need to use colours from one system in another. I know its not as black and white as that i carry mainly cnd polish but have nubar and opi but do you see what i mean? To me it just seems a bit odd. It is very simple; by allowing other brands to be used with it, Gelish opens up a whole range of colors to its customers. That way, if one sees colors in another brand, one does not have to leave Gelish to use it. Regardless of what you or I may think, the lack of a broad range of colors is one of the perceived major failings of Shellac. Harmony obviously saw that and capitalized on it. That said what over rides all of this is product chemistry- gelish is a gel polish and simply shellac is not. Yes, it is. It just isn't 100% gel. And further to that is insurance- if we check the fine print of our insurance its more than likely insuring you to use the whole system as per the manufacturers instruction, so you use gelish with a shellac colour, harmony says hey you can use shellac, cnd doesnt.

Now I'm not saying that Shellac isn't a great product. It is and our clients love it. But as nail professionals we need to separate the fact from the marketing hype - and companies like CND and OPI and Harmony have a lot of hype going. Shellac is a gel polish, a hybrid gel polish. It is not the only one - Light Elegance P2, IBD Gelac and LeChat Perfect Patch come to mind. Shellac and the others exist on a spectrum from being like regular nail polish to 100% gel - but they are all gel polishes.

Love n hugs x x x

As far as we have always been told by our CND Educators, there are no Gel components in Shellac. THAT is why it was a hybrid product, because it was unique in it's make up, application AND removal. We don't know the full science behind it, only those at CND do (as possibly other but you get my drift, we as technicians don't know the ins and outs) and yes, on the MSDS sheet, it "describes" it as a Gel laquer but the ingredient it states that is in it is Butyl Acetate. This is the description for this chemical:

"n-Butyl acetate, also known as butyl ethanoate, is an organic compound commonly used as a solvent in the production of lacquers and other products. It is a colorless flammable liquid."

So it is a liquid, that I assume is developed in different ways for different purposes. It does not list it as a Gel or Gel component. I am not a scientist to know how chemical work etc but if we have been told that Shellac is NOT a Gel, then it is not a gel and that's what I will believe :wink2:

If Shellac has Gel components, then why is it the only product that does NOT require buffing of the nail plate during the nail prep, nor buffing to break the seal or remove from the nails plate after?

 

[souz]

i think if you are getting asked specifically for gelish then get it to run alongside your shellac, having said that i would first be asking clients WHY they are asking for gelish. If it is colour and they do want neon then go ahead.

I have to agree with gigi that i dont like the neon colours and never been asking for them! i have clients from age 13 to 75 so a pretty wide spectrum and have had no problems colour wise with shellac. In fact i have been amazed at how clients have taken to it and are now in fact preferring it to bio sculpture which i also do.

I think where colour is concerned between shellac and now the additives i think you can let your imagination run wild! and inspire your clients. I also find that whatever i am wearing clients get inspiration from that....lately i have been having alot of glittery nails and one by one so have all my clients!!even the ones that are die hard french or conservative colour!!


Maybe it is the way you are marketing products???xx

 

[JuicyLucy]

I think this is the Jan Arnold interview Nancy is talking about

Jan Arnold CND Shellac Global Education 2010 - YouTube

"Shellac takes the best of polish and the best of gel and combines the two".

Planky, most of us who use Gelish have found that there is also no need to buff the nail plate before application or removal and we still manage a 10 minute removal.

 

[Planky1]

I think this is the Jan Arnold interview Nancy is talking about

Jan Arnold CND Shellac Global Education 2010 - YouTube

"Shellac takes the best of polish and the best of gel and combines the two".

Planky, most of us who use Gelish have found that there is also no need to buff the nail plate before application or removal and we still manage a 10 minute removal.

I haven't watched that video above yet but have just been watching a video on CND about the perfect Shellac French manicure and she calls Negligee Sheer Pink. So could be possible that she said it wrong perhaps?! I know she's the co-founder and should get things right but just saying :wink2: Also, you can't really take from that statement that it is MADE with Gel in it though can you, it's taking the best "qualities" of both and joining them together, meaning their performance perhaps and not the components of their make up.

I don't work with Gelish, all I know about it, is from reading on here and from what I have read, most people have said about filing and buffing the nail during prep and removal. I'm not disregarding or slating other companies, I may introduce something else later on down the line, who knows, I'm just replying mainly to the point of Shellac being a Gel when we have always been told it's not.

Would be good to hear from either of the Sam's or Gigi on this, seems to be some confusion in the forms of MSDS sheets, videos etc and what they are saying.

 

[geeg]

I'm not getting into it ... any fool only has to use Shellac to realize that it is completely different to gel. It feels different, it looks different and it handles differently. Yes it shares some of the qualities we like about gel but it is not a true gel or a watered down version of coloured gels; Shellac has far more characteristics of polish and it is UV cured. I see nothing inconsistent with the statement above unless someone wants to make something out of it. If that is your agenda, then you can make something out of anything.

Shellac is hypo-allergenic (which gel colour coats are not) which proves it is chemically different; it requires no buffing of the natural to make it stick to the nail [despite what some may tell you they do with gel .. the ones who say they don't buff (if they are being honest) they are usually applying to tired, damaged, ex- ehhancement clients whose nails are already dry and probably rough (many gel users have confirmed this point to me) whereas, we Shallackers tend to apply Shellac to clients who already have beautiful natural nails and who want th3em to stay that way and do not want the surface touched by file or buffer. and we do not need to. NOR do I need to retail them some new product to re-vitalize their nails after using it!

It doesn't have to be a war or an inquisition ladies. If you want to use gel use gel .. if you want to use Shellac use Shellac ... I use it, I love it, my clients love it; their are nails are beautiful month after month and I am not embarrassed!! I do not need more colours than I have and that suits us all just fine n dandy. I do get weary of the colour argument when we have hundreds of options with Shellac and it's a cheaper and better option for my business than buying tonnes of colours and looking at them sit on the shelf..

So have fun all with whatever you are using and for whatever reasons you are using it. I have definite reasons, with my clients' safety and best interests at heart for using Shellac and only Shellac. Enjoy the rest of your weekend.

 

[Nails<3]

I'm not getting into it ... any fool only has to use Shellac to realize that it is completely different to gel. Yes it shares some of the qualities we like about gel but it is not a true gel or a watered down version of coloured gels it has far more characteristics of polish.

Shellac is hypo-allergenic (which gel colour coats are not) which proves it is chemically different; it requires no buffing of the natural nail despite what some may tell you they do with gel .. the ones who don't buff (if they are being honest) are usually applying to tired, damaged, ex- ehhancement clients whose nails are already dry and probably rough (many gel users have confirmed this point to me) whereas, we tend to apply Shellac to clients who already have beautiful natural nails and do not want the surface touched by file or buffer. and we do not need to.

It doesn't have to be a war or an inquisition ladies. If you want to use gel use gel .. if you want to use Shellac use Shellac ... I use it, I love it, my clients love it; their are nails are beautiful month after month and I am not embarrassed NOR do I need to retail them some new product to re-vitalize their nails after using it! I do not need more colours than I have and that suits us all just fine n dandy. I do get weary of the colour argument when we have hundreds of options with Shellac and it's a cheaper and better option for my business than buying tonnes of colours and looking at them sit on the shelf..

So have fun all with whatever you are using and for whatever reasons you are using it. I have definite reasons, with my clients' safety and best interests at heart for using Shellac and only Shellac. Enjoy the rest of your weekend.

Does is contain gel or not as it seems you haven't confirmed?

 

[geeg]

Does is contain gel or not as it seems you haven't confirmed?

Shellac is not gel and it is not gel with a bunch of other stuff dumped into it. Skellac is one on its own; a completely different formulation and there is nothing else like it chemically nor will there be.

 

[Nails<3]

Shellac is not gel and it is not gel with a bunch of other stuff dumped into it. Skellac is one on its own; a completely different formulation and there is nothing else like it chemically nor will there be.

That still isn't answering my question though? I didn't ask whether it was a gel, I asked if it contained any gel.

 

[geeg]

I answered the question perfectly adequately ... clear as a bell to me. What is your problem? What do you not understand about "Shellac is not gel and it is not gel with a bunch of other stuff dumped into it."

 

[Nails<3]

I answered the question perfectly adequately ... clear as a bell to me. What is your problem? What do you not understand about "Shellac is not gel and it is not gel with a bunch of other stuff dumped into it."

What I don't understand as you so nicely put it is that you have stated that shellac isn't a gel, and isn't a gel with other stuff dumped into it which I presume you are talking about gel polishes, but you haven't confirmed that shellac has no form of gel in it what so ever. I'm not asking whether shellac is a gel polish I am asking whether shellac contains any gel at all.

I know the speel about shellac being one and only and all that, but there is confusing information on here regarding shellac. Some people say it contains no gel at all and some say it does. So does it contain any trace of gel or does it not?

 

[geeg]

What I don't understand as you so nicely put it is that you have stated that shellac isn't a gel, and isn't a gel with other stuff dumped into it which I presume you are talking about gel polishes, but you haven't confirmed that shellac has no form of gel in it what so ever. I'm not asking whether shellac is a gel polish I am asking whether shellac contains any gel at all.

I know the speel about shellac being one and only and all that, but there is confusing information on here regarding shellac. Some people say it contains no gel at all and some say it does. So does it contain any trace of gel or does it not?

I think you are flogging a dead horse for what reason I do not know. I have said Shellac is not a gel ... it is not a gel plus a bunch of other things added (trace amount or lots and lots of it). What is your definition of gel? Lets hear it. I'm not confused .. other users don't seem to be confused, maybe it is you that is confused so explain to me what you think a gel, or a form of a gel is? And what point exactly are you trying so hard to make here?

 

[Nails<3]

I think you are flogging a dead horse for what reason I do not know. I have said Shellac is not a gel ... it is not a gel plus a bunch of other things added (trace amount or lots and lots of it). What is your definition of gel? Lets hear it.

I don't know where you get off speaking to people like crap Gigi! You are rude and obnoxious. Many people on here love you for what reason I do not know. You talk down to people and make them feel stupid. I asked a simple question.In return I get "what's your problem".

I did not ask if shellac was a gel!!