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Kacoons

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Ok, I feel like crud right now. I just had a set of the hardest nails to do in my life. I had a lady come in today and I am not sure I handled this correctly at all!

She had the toughest nails ever, she is a "little person" and her nails are very flat and very concave. Extremely wide at the free edge, wavy overall and very very short nailbeds, to the point that a half well tip would cover her entire nail bed. What to do .... well I decided sculpting was the way to go.:grr:

Bad move on my part, I couldn't get the forms to fit at all, it's hard to describe but if you've ever done nails like this you would understand. They fit at the edges since they are quite wide but I couldn't get them to snug up under the center of her nail, not to mention the fact that the nail itself was wavy, very high spots and very low dips when looking down the barrel. How the heck do you deal with nails like that???

I did the best I could and for the most part they didn't look absolutely horrid but I did my very first set better then these. Her thumb was totally mucked up, and the end result of her set looked like little bulbous fans...OMG I am mortified.

It took 3 hours and in my frustration I even sliced the side of her finger with my damn file. It seemed the more I tried to make them look "normal" the worse they got. I almost didn't charge her I felt so bad. So I guess my question (in amongst my rant) is this.... what would you have done, how do you make forms fit funky fingers? Would it have better to just glue on welless tips (althoug trying to fit them would have been a nightmare but maybe less of one then trying to sculpt)

Gah I feel awful, I know I'm going to dream about these.
 

geeg

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Oh man, I have been there!! We all want to make things perfect for everybody but ....

You know the saying, "You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear." These sound pretty piggy to me. Sometimes you just can't.

I personally would not have sculpted these nails. I think you set yourself a very hard task when you needn't have done.

I would have tipped and regularised the shape and recommended a polish colour to help the whole outcome look sleek.

People with nails like this look SO much better painted than in Pink and white, which needs a nice proportion to look anything like beautiful.

I might have custom blended to make the nail bed look longer IF her nails were nice enough to look good after the treatment.

Another one to Chalk up to experience, hun. :hug:
 

rebeccaj

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OMG, you poor thing. Sorry I cant offer any advise I wouldn't have a clue. Curious though, had she ever had enhancements before if so did you ask what she had had done? If not, maybe she was ok with them, if she has never had long nails before she probably only saw the extra length and perhaps didn't have as critical an eye as you? Maybe?
 

'chelle

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commiserations dear!! My mother in law has difficult nails (although not quite as bad as the ones you have described!) You mentioned that her nails were very ridged and pitted. I know that lots of people have these anyway, but did she have any sort of medical reason behind these nails??
 

sj1973

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welcome to the site hun.....trouble is,peoples nails are not always the same or we would have it easy !!!!! i just wondered....if this happens again and you did decide to sculpt.....could you have extended the nail bed so the form would have fitted better.....or done the free edge with no form?????????? i have never had a client like this so for future for everyone.....would these have helped?????xx
 

geeg

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welcome to the site hun.....trouble is,peoples nails are not always the same or we would have it easy !!!!! i just wondered....if this happens again and you did decide to sculpt.....could you have extended the nail bed so the form would have fitted better.....or done the free edge with no form?????????? i have never had a client like this so for future for everyone.....would these have helped?????xx
Why make hard work for yourself?

With a tip you have instant order quickly and you do not have to work for it.

ALWAYS do what is easiest for YOU and that which will give the best result.

It's not as if using tips is giving a 2nd class service. The client is getting just as good a service and you have less angst and can do the nails in a reasonable commercial time with a good result.

If you had extended the free edge and then done an overlay etc etc it would have taken much more time than the client is paying for when she has a full set service.

Be smart ladies. You are in business. You have to develop a commercial head on your shoulders.
 

Katmoz33

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think i would have passed out acidentally on purpose and gone home! :eek:
 

Bagpuss

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kinda reminds me of when i used to be in hairdressing....this lady came in with very very fine hair...almost see through to her scalp...pulled out a picture of Samantha Fox and said she wanted it to look like that...:lol:....

we can do our best for clients but we cant do the impossible. x
 

Guy Fawkes

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:lol:
kinda reminds me of when i used to be in hairdressing....this lady came in with very very fine hair...almost see through to her scalp...pulled out a picture of Samantha Fox and said she wanted it to look like that.....

we can do our best for clients but we cant do the impossible. x
That made me laugh!!!! :lol:
 

blossom

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It's not as if using tips is giving a 2nd class service. The client is getting just as good a service and you have less angst and can do the nails in a reasonable commercial time with a good result.


Ahh this was music to my ears! I can sculpt but tbh I prefer tips unless the nails are just so and make sculpting a pleasure. Therefore I mostly tip cos there's not that many of those perfect nail beds about! :lol:

I have a client who will not have a tip, looks at my tip box as if it's something I scratched up off the pavement, and to whom "tip" is a dirty word. It's only really now and then when she breaks one and needs a replacement that this comes up. I automatically reach for the tip box and she puts her hands under the table and goes "you're not going to use those are you!" And yet when I've finished the sculpt, it looks identical to how it would look if I'd tipped and overlayed for heavens sake! And would have been easier for me!
 

Kacoons

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I did end up doing most of them without a form at the free edge, I had no choice. If I had my time back I would just do tips as suggested. I started out that way but in my infinite wisdom (oye ROFL) I figured forms would be better. Never again, not on her. I would have had to customize all the tips but I'm sure (at least I think I'm sure) the end result would have been nicer and most certainly faster.

>>think i would have passed out acidentally on purpose and gone home!<<

HA! I tell you, at one point I said to my daughter..... I think maybe I'll just open a Gym instead and be done with it. I really wanted to just cry and leave.

With the tips I was afraid that they may not bond properly or I couldn't have gotten them to fit quite right or.. I don't know. When I think of it now and after reading all the comments (thank you so much by the way) I most certainly should have just done tips.

She "has" had enhancements before and I'm sure that's all that was done. I wanted to be the hero and make her nails look beautiful for her. Silly me! Apparently she is coming back in two weeks....we shall see. I don't think I can ever give her beautiful nails but I'm sure I can do better then the slop I just gave her.

Commercial head commercial head commercial head (my new mantra) My daughter keeps telling me I'm too much of a perfectionist, too picky, etc. (in business - commercial head) It's amazing what a hit your confidence takes after something like this. I guess it's keeps us humble.
 

geeg

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Ahh this was music to my ears! I can sculpt but tbh I prefer tips unless the nails are just so and make sculpting a pleasure. Therefore I mostly tip cos there's not that many of those perfect nail beds about! :lol:

I have a client who will not have a tip, looks at my tip box as if it's something I scratched up off the pavement, and to whom "tip" is a dirty word. It's only really now and then when she breaks one and needs a replacement that this comes up. I automatically reach for the tip box and she puts her hands under the table and goes "you're not going to use those are you!" And yet when I've finished the sculpt, it looks identical to how it would look if I'd tipped and overlaid for heavens sake! And would have been easier for me!
Do You know where clients get these sorts of ideas?? From nail technicians that sculpt and therefore bad mouth those who don't to try and make themselves look exclusive and others like they are offering a second class job.

I call them sculpting snobs and they think they are red hot nail divas!! :lol:

Well, unless you are brilliant at it, sculpted nails are often more ugly than when tips are used, and break more easily because they are not structured correctly or else they are way too thick and look gross.

If YOU ARE brilliant at sculpting then they look just like you have used a tip and overlay but you've done it without a tip by yourself :eek: SO? That's nice and all that, and it is artistically satisfying for the technician, and it might make them feel superior, but it isn't any better of a service. It won't last any longer than a well maintained tip and overlay.

A sculpt might be a tad stronger (and I emphasise it is only a tad) than a tip, at the point where it is stuck on, but if you break a sculpt it will cause more damage to the natural nail than breaking a tip off.

My point is that when you prescribe a service (tip or sculpt) for a client you should be thinking:

1. What will look the best on this client when I am finished?
2. Will a sculpt or a tip and overlay be the easiest way for me to achieve this look?
3. Will a sculpt or a tip and overlay be the quickest way for me to achieve this look?
4. Make your decision based on those 3 things.

Like most professional nail technicians I do both and I love doing both but I choose to do what is commercially the best option based on the client's natural nail shape and condition.
 

nailzoo

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When I read this post, I got a picture in my mind .... reeeeeeally wide flat nail beds on quite stubby fingers.

If she didn't have a free-edge, I wouldn't have sculpted .... gaaaaawd I can't get this picture out of my head.

Some stubby nails on nail biters can really show some potential (particularly when you are experienced and have witnessed the miracle after a few weeks of the free-edge not growing, but the eponichium receding and giving a longer/sleeker and more streamlined look), eventually looking respectable.

Sometimes enhancements can actually make nails look worse, or draw more attention to them. Gotta get this picture out of my head .......get out of my head, get out of my head.

I understand some peeps need to "nail the world".

Tips do give an instant shape, but when the shape underneath is shyte, all you are gonna end up with is "flashing neon signs saying look at my even longer shyte nails" that all 10 of them look like ridiculously long big toenails.

I'm actually gonna bow out of this one as gracefully and tactfully as possible, but if these nails look anything like the ones I have in my imagination .... get out of my head, get out of my head.

If she was a walk in (I would have been booked for the next week).
If she had booked beforehand and turned up ( I would have recommended manicures and treatments ...... hopefully expensive enough to discourage her forever).

Some people are beyond help, I admire your courage in taking this client on, but it sounds like they would have ended up being ugly no matter what you did (and therefore being a walking, talking, visual, in your face example of your work) often discouraging anyone that sees them ever wanting to partake of your services.

To be quite honest, without sounding like a wanker ........ I would have put aside my need to make money and dodged this bullet altogether, ever so subtly without offending. I'm old enough, stupid enough (yet sensible enough) to know my capabilities and envision the end result, even when applying all of my years and skills.

It's not a question of sculptures or tips, sometimes no nails at all is the better option.

A very smart and well respected lady said something along similar lines in a post on here somewhere far far away. Albeit a little less graphic than my reply.

I've run out of vodka and have no wine, so I'm gonna have to resort to a beer left in my fridge by a visitor and half a Valium to try and wash this picture out of my mind.:)
 

adelekeegan1

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Do You know where clients get these sorts of ideas?? From nail technicians that sculpt and therefore bad mouth those who don't to try and make themselves look exclusive and others like they are offering a second class job.

I call them sculpting snobs and they think they are red hot nail divas!! :lol:

Well, unless you are brilliant at it, sculpted nails are often more ugly than when tips are used, and break more easily because they are not structured correctly or else they are way too thick and look gross.

If YOU ARE brilliant at sculpting then they look just like you have used a tip and overlay but you've done it without a tip by yourself :eek: SO? That's nice and all that, and it is artistically satisfying for the technician, and it might make them feel superior, but it isn't any better of a service. It won't last any longer than a well maintained tip and overlay.

A sculpt might be a tad stronger (and I emphasise it is only a tad) than a tip, at the point where it is stuck on, but if you break a sculpt it will cause more damage to the natural nail than breaking a tip off.

My point is that when you prescribe a service (tip or sculpt) for a client you should be thinking:

1. What will look the best on this client when I am finished?
2. Will a sculpt or a tip and overlay be the easiest way for me to achieve this look?
3. Will a sculpt or a tip and overlay be the quickest way for me to achieve this look?
4. Make your decision based on those 3 things.

Like most professional nail technicians I do both and I love doing both but I choose to do what is commercially the best option based on the client's natural nail shape and condition.
When I read this post, I got a picture in my mind .... reeeeeeally wide flat nail beds on quite stubby fingers.

If she didn't have a free-edge, I wouldn't have sculpted .... gaaaaawd I can't get this picture out of my head.

Some stubby nails on nail biters can really show some potential (particularly when you are experienced and have witnessed the miracle after a few weeks of the free-edge not growing, but the eponichium receding and giving a longer/sleeker and more streamlined look), eventually looking respectable.

Sometimes enhancements can actually make nails look worse, or draw more attention to them. Gotta get this picture out of my head .......get out of my head, get out of my head.

I understand some peeps need to "nail the world".

Tips do give an instant shape, but when the shape underneath is shyte, all you are gonna end up with is "flashing neon signs saying look at my even longer shyte nails" that all 10 of them look like ridiculously long big toenails.

I'm actually gonna bow out of this one as gracefully and tactfully as possible, but if these nails look anything like the ones I have in my imagination .... get out of my head, get out of my head.

If she was a walk in (I would have been booked for the next week).
If she had booked beforehand and turned up ( I would have recommended manicures and treatments ...... hopefully expensive enough to discourage her forever).

Some people are beyond help, I admire your courage in taking this client on, but it sounds like they would have ended up being ugly no matter what you did (and therefore being a walking, talking, visual, in your face example of your work) often discouraging anyone that sees them ever wanting to partake of your services.

To be quite honest, without sounding like a wanker ........ I would have put aside my need to make money and dodged this bullet altogether, ever so subtly without offending. I'm old enough, stupid enough (yet sensible enough) to know my capabilities and envision the end result, even when applying all of my years and skills.

It's not a question of sculptures or tips, sometimes no nails at all is the better option.

A very smart and well respected lady said something along similar lines in a post on here somewhere far far away. Albeit a little less graphic than my reply.

I've run out of vodka and have no wine, so I'm gonna have to resort to a beer left in my fridge by a visitor and half a Valium to try and wash this picture out of my mind.:)
Well there you go.
I have now had it confirmed by two technicians with a combined experience of nearly my age, sculpting, love it though I do, is not necessarily the ultimate answer to those with horrible nails.
Many people (techs and clients) parade it like the crown jewels but it clearly doesn't solve everything.
 

nailzoo

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Well there you go.
I have now had it confirmed by two technicians with a combined experience of nearly my age, sculpting, love it though I do, is not necessarily the ultimate answer to those with horrible nails.
Many people (techs and clients) parade it like the crown jewels but it clearly doesn't solve everything.

Did someone get you a sterling silver hammer ? Cause you just hit the nail on the head.:lol:
 

Snugglepuss

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I'm sorry I missed this thread earlier in the week! I have just read it with great interest and would just like to say:-

Thank you Kacoons for asking the question and telling us about the awful ordeal you went through - and by the way - I think you are a star, handling it in the way in which you did - (bet you wish you had seen the nails before and had the opportunity of asking the geeks their opinions first - I would have:eek:)

But also a big thank you to the people for the replies - I have learnt something new OR a different way of thinking about dealing with a situation.

Rightio back to checking out posts my favourite geeks have replied on :wink2:
 

Louise Manby

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Ok short stumpy flat nails I can do! Woo hoo for me! No seriously I have loads of experience in doing really short, severely bitten, flat, what the f*** are those kinda nails and I tip them. I ALWAYS cut the well part in half or more then half so that when I put the tip on it only goes half way or better still just a few milimeters down from the free edge (if there is one - if not just stick it down anyway!) Buff the end to make it thinner before you stick it, this will make blending easier. Usually the shape of the tip brings down their wavy free edges so that you get a better shape to work with. Also (and forgive me as Im crap at explaining things) if their nails have a slight dip at the sides between the cuticle area and where the fress edge starts ie, it doesnt go in a fairly straight line which would be exaggerated when you apply gel/l&p, try filing the nail sides in a bit (make them not so wide) and then applying gel/l&P ignoring the dippy bits at the side and trying to form a better (flase) shape. OMGod its sooo hard to explain.:irked:
 

lilly

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yes yes yes !!!! i'm SO pleased i read this thread, i consider myself c..p at sculpting, a sculpt repair on a chipped nail great but a complete sculpt, gulp!!! i always felt rubbish because i cant do them and always tip but when i read gigis post i felt tonns better, thanks xxx :hug:
 

xAnnaBannAx

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just a couple of questions........if someone has a wavy finger nail and you put a tip on....would you not get air pockets under the tip therefore a high risk of something growing under there? and if someone has really bad nails as you described....can they not be rescued and improved by regular manicures etc before actually enhancing them?
 

Susie H

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Ok, my 9 pennith worth:lol:
Buisness head on Did she love them? Because bottom line thats what its about, 9 times out of 10 I finish a set and think, they could of been better, but the client thinks they are great:lol:
I think I would have done a wow, I lack the skill to make these look lovely and sent her on her way to find a master tech, cowardly I know but...........
On a academic level, because I don't have to do this for real and I'm just curious to hear from other geeks if this would work, what about reverse application with a custom blend, so you fit the form and apply the pink first bringing it over the form to the length you want, shape your smile and then apply your white. Would this take care of that wavy free edge or make it worse? and would that allow you to disguise the over all shape?
 

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