Is it illegal to have non accredited courses?
- Thread starter Violet Star
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Lynne Baker
Lynne The Skin!
I'm flattered that you think I'm a smart cookie, but I'm not smart enough to believe that anyone, of any age, wouldn't check with CND/Eaziflow (I think I might have spelt that incorrectly!)/NSI/whoever for authorised courses! Would they?! Do people really buy a course out the back of the paper without checking first?!
Violet Star
Well-Known Member
You would be surprised! Ive had tanning students of mine willing enough to purchase a tanning machine via ebay and not listen to my advice on dont buy on ebay as if something goes wrong then you have lost allot of money.
I think people get too excited by the prices and convenience of some courses and dont think about authorisation or accreditation, some arent even aware that courses are not accredited.
Of course us as professionals cannot see why people dont check first but its because we are aware of the cons. Before going on a course i always check they are accredited.
xx
Lynne Baker
Lynne The Skin!
But surely, this is nothing more than common sense?! Even really young girls - don't they ask their parents for guidance in this?
I think I need to spend some time with this kind of person because I truly, truly can't get into their mindset.
:sad:
I think I need to spend some time with this kind of person because I truly, truly can't get into their mindset.
:sad:
adelekeegan1
Chatty geek
This is really interesting.
I decided to do my nail training at the age of 50. I guess I was lucky because there is a CND academy only 8 miles from me and they advertised in the local yellow pages, I signed up and the rest, as they say is history.
I spent the majority of my working life in accountancy, then started a business of my own in interior design and am very well versed in business from all angles BUT knew absolutely nothing about the beauty industry.
It simply never crossed my mind that there could be training courses that weren't 'right', I had never heard of the Guild, BABTAC etc and assumed insurance would be available if you had trained etc etc etc.
I am not naive, I've certainly been around the block but didn't realize that, unlike the USA system for example, that it was all such a minefield. In my case, I could afford to pay for quality training, I learnt fast and for both nails and tanning got excellent quality training accepted by any insurance company.
It is easy for me to see how so many get conned or misled..........this is just another point of view from someone who was not gullible just lacking in information that they didn't know they needed.
I decided to do my nail training at the age of 50. I guess I was lucky because there is a CND academy only 8 miles from me and they advertised in the local yellow pages, I signed up and the rest, as they say is history.
I spent the majority of my working life in accountancy, then started a business of my own in interior design and am very well versed in business from all angles BUT knew absolutely nothing about the beauty industry.
It simply never crossed my mind that there could be training courses that weren't 'right', I had never heard of the Guild, BABTAC etc and assumed insurance would be available if you had trained etc etc etc.
I am not naive, I've certainly been around the block but didn't realize that, unlike the USA system for example, that it was all such a minefield. In my case, I could afford to pay for quality training, I learnt fast and for both nails and tanning got excellent quality training accepted by any insurance company.
It is easy for me to see how so many get conned or misled..........this is just another point of view from someone who was not gullible just lacking in information that they didn't know they needed.
The Guild
Well-Known Member
Accredited with the Guild means that we have checked the courses and have confirmed that they are suitable for insurance purposes.
Just as an extra pointer, we have come across a number of schools and companies lately that are claiming to be Guild accredited when they are not. Some were previously accredited and are not any more, others have never been accredited at all. We cannot accept certificates from these schools, so please double check the claims of any schools before enrolling on the course. Just call us and we will confirm whether we can accept the certificate or not.
Violet Star
Well-Known Member
True it should come with common sense. I think if the young ones were to ask their parents i dont think their parents would know the good from the bad.
Most young girls who do go into the beauty industry attend their local college, I myself didnt do this as i prefer private training with the top companies i.e CND, Couture, Kim lawless for waxing.
I can see our point as to think why would you go ahead and train without even checking? But i can also see another's point of view to think they are none the wiser as to whats the best training or whether they are a genuine company.
I think the best thing that could be done is for it to be illegal to offer non accredited courses, as you are aware non accredited courses are not worth doing as there is no way they could get insurance, and no insurance means no working.
As i am now setting up training and going college to get my teaching cert, i could easily choose the cheaper and easier option by not getting them accredited but i care for my students and want them to have the best quality training their money can buy.
Companies who do go the lazy way and dont bother getting their courses accredited wont last long at all, those who do pull out the stops to offer quality accredited training will go allot further as they will be trusted.
minky
Well-Known Member
Hi, going back a bit now lol x as a salon owner I used to train up lots appretinces many years ago, this was before Habia and NVQs were around the Guild may have been around as the hairdressers Guild ? cant remember Babtac though, VTCs were around and IHBCs and City & Guilds and salon apprenticeships,
our trainees used to go to college one day a week and we had two training nights per week within the salon ,where myself and the top stylists used to stay behind and train them , and at the end of three years they were given a City & Guilds certificate from their college if they passed thier exams ,
There were different routes back then, and some hairdressers just did an apprenticeship within the salon that had an apprenticeship scheme
my friend did her apprenticeship with Peter collinge (Andrews Dad) and she never held a single certificate for 20 odd years,
but ...she was a fully insured hairdresser and has worked as such managing a salon for all these years ,
I held City& Guilds with distinctions, but Later we did our NVQ L3 together,
and I trained and assesed NVQs at a hair salon attatched to a training school and Habia were the main body for dealing with NVQ assessing routes
plus City & Guilds still give out certification , which goes hand in hand with Habia and has world wide recognition
then seemed to be a great gap betwen NVQ training and private routes
and there were many good private trainers that have been training without accredtation for many years , some good some not so good , but I would say mostly were pretty good ,
but there was still a gap here
this is when private accreditation courses after many years came along and filled it
to set out good guidelines and standards for private courses
now we know no educator gets forced to go down this route but ..... insurance companys have a safer time insuring trainers that have been vetted out and down this route rather than not vetted out ...
so a private accreditor will check out a course for a trainer and get them to meet their private set standards and strict guidelines
the trainer usually has many years of experience under their belt and probably already trains others and is very kowledgebale , but can strenghten their weak areas ect...
and as some private trainers simply don't want to go down the NVQ route
if they choose private accreditation
then they won't have to have an NVQ assessors present which makes things a lot easier ,
I also realise private accredtation very in depth and it can roll out over quite some time to get it all right, as there are many elements to go over when accrediting the private training course,
I have seen it all happen with Babtac and they really do have good guidelines and standards ,
The thing is most private trainers realise they may have go down this private route for their insurance reasons ,
but I also think it will be good in the long run
as it will help good experienced trainers get a better deal ,
especially from the inexperienced within the industry who think they can open a training school and get rich quick (which just does not happen )
and who are wanting to teach in depth courses themselves ;
like nail enhancements, waxing, Hairdressing, Beauty ect ... straight from college or with just a few years of experience ,
it takes years and years of hard slog to be able to personally train people
yourself ,
but there is nothing stoping anyone from employing a private trainer for their school , no problem there ,
but they cannot and should not be training others without many years of experience under their belt,
and if accredtited private training courses can prevent this from happening then I can see why its a good thing ,
we must ask ourselves....
what insurance company would want to insure those people who have trained with an inexperienced trainer ?
or a not so good trainer ?
this is one of the reasons why we are now needing private accredtitaton,
yes it pushes the prices up for the fab genuine trainers ,
but they will benefit form more business in the long run because being accredted is no easy fete and will speak for itself , :hug: x minky
our trainees used to go to college one day a week and we had two training nights per week within the salon ,where myself and the top stylists used to stay behind and train them , and at the end of three years they were given a City & Guilds certificate from their college if they passed thier exams ,
There were different routes back then, and some hairdressers just did an apprenticeship within the salon that had an apprenticeship scheme
my friend did her apprenticeship with Peter collinge (Andrews Dad) and she never held a single certificate for 20 odd years,
but ...she was a fully insured hairdresser and has worked as such managing a salon for all these years ,
I held City& Guilds with distinctions, but Later we did our NVQ L3 together,
and I trained and assesed NVQs at a hair salon attatched to a training school and Habia were the main body for dealing with NVQ assessing routes
plus City & Guilds still give out certification , which goes hand in hand with Habia and has world wide recognition
then seemed to be a great gap betwen NVQ training and private routes
and there were many good private trainers that have been training without accredtation for many years , some good some not so good , but I would say mostly were pretty good ,
but there was still a gap here
this is when private accreditation courses after many years came along and filled it
to set out good guidelines and standards for private courses
now we know no educator gets forced to go down this route but ..... insurance companys have a safer time insuring trainers that have been vetted out and down this route rather than not vetted out ...
so a private accreditor will check out a course for a trainer and get them to meet their private set standards and strict guidelines
the trainer usually has many years of experience under their belt and probably already trains others and is very kowledgebale , but can strenghten their weak areas ect...
and as some private trainers simply don't want to go down the NVQ route
if they choose private accreditation
then they won't have to have an NVQ assessors present which makes things a lot easier ,
I also realise private accredtation very in depth and it can roll out over quite some time to get it all right, as there are many elements to go over when accrediting the private training course,
I have seen it all happen with Babtac and they really do have good guidelines and standards ,
The thing is most private trainers realise they may have go down this private route for their insurance reasons ,
but I also think it will be good in the long run
as it will help good experienced trainers get a better deal ,
especially from the inexperienced within the industry who think they can open a training school and get rich quick (which just does not happen )
and who are wanting to teach in depth courses themselves ;
like nail enhancements, waxing, Hairdressing, Beauty ect ... straight from college or with just a few years of experience ,
it takes years and years of hard slog to be able to personally train people
yourself ,
but there is nothing stoping anyone from employing a private trainer for their school , no problem there ,
but they cannot and should not be training others without many years of experience under their belt,
and if accredtited private training courses can prevent this from happening then I can see why its a good thing ,
we must ask ourselves....
what insurance company would want to insure those people who have trained with an inexperienced trainer ?
or a not so good trainer ?
this is one of the reasons why we are now needing private accredtitaton,
yes it pushes the prices up for the fab genuine trainers ,
but they will benefit form more business in the long run because being accredted is no easy fete and will speak for itself , :hug: x minky
tigi
Well-Known Member
Calla
In response I can say from my own experience that I and many others have recently fallen foul of a certain person who claims to be part of the cnd family. she is very convincing, the certificates seem real, she even decks out her premises with brass plaques that say creative nail academy manchester.
her website makes the same claims. What I would say is that when a new person comes into the industry, she often does not know at all who to contact or where to check that the training she thinks she has found is genuine. I even had my funder check with them and they signed off the training as they believed her to be genuine. People like her and others rely on trying to make out they are genuine, that is how they get away with it. Con artists are artists, they are very good at what they do, its how they make their living.
I am not a child, am 39, am mum to four kids, own my own business and feel that i am not easily duped. I had no reason to believe that i was being lied to. I paid the price. 1800 pounds in total for shoddy training and most of that is fake.
I recently told my stry in an attempt to stop anyone else from having this happen to them. I got help from sweet squard and am currently taking it further legally to try and put an end to this.
anytime you are passing this lovely part of the world, please feel free to stop into the salon and have a brew and a chat and we can talk some more about how this happened to me. xx
In response I can say from my own experience that I and many others have recently fallen foul of a certain person who claims to be part of the cnd family. she is very convincing, the certificates seem real, she even decks out her premises with brass plaques that say creative nail academy manchester.
her website makes the same claims. What I would say is that when a new person comes into the industry, she often does not know at all who to contact or where to check that the training she thinks she has found is genuine. I even had my funder check with them and they signed off the training as they believed her to be genuine. People like her and others rely on trying to make out they are genuine, that is how they get away with it. Con artists are artists, they are very good at what they do, its how they make their living.
I am not a child, am 39, am mum to four kids, own my own business and feel that i am not easily duped. I had no reason to believe that i was being lied to. I paid the price. 1800 pounds in total for shoddy training and most of that is fake.
I recently told my stry in an attempt to stop anyone else from having this happen to them. I got help from sweet squard and am currently taking it further legally to try and put an end to this.
anytime you are passing this lovely part of the world, please feel free to stop into the salon and have a brew and a chat and we can talk some more about how this happened to me. xx
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normacol
New Member
- do you no what i have spent all week going mad, i have just opened a new salon,and advertised in the job centre for staff,what they have sent me is nobodys buisness, all paid for by the goverment(£2500) they have been told to
- buy off ebay
- mix any l and p becouse it is all made in the same factory
- mix any gels (same)
- use resin not glue for tips
- blend tips with acetone
- never to use solar oil (as it could kill a person with a nut allergy) THIS IS MY BEST SELLER EVER !
I HAD TO STOP THE OPEN DAY AND SEND 9 LADIES HOME. I COULD NOT CONTINUE WITH THE INTERVIEWS.IM DISTRAUGHT TO EVEN THINK THAT THIS HAPPENS,AND THE POOR STANDARDS FOR TRAINNING IS UNABELIVABLE.I DID COMPLAIN AND GOT NO WHERE ! BUT THIS SO CALLED TRAINNING CENTRE IS GETTING £THOUSANDS FOR NOUGHT.AND IS COMMON PRACTICE X:irked:
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Unfortunately, in this industry there are alot of false claims that go around, and we can only deal with them as they come up.
I can say that, i am the ONLY EzFlow distributor and the ONLY EzFlow Educator in Wales. I am saddened that someone is making such claims as to be an accredited EzFlow Training Centre, as there are no such Centres. I do supply EzFlow Kits for courses run by Independant Training facitlities but no-one is accredited to give EzFlow certificates or claim they are associated with EzFlow in any way, If you are in Wales and want to complete an EzFlow course backed by an EzFlow certificate then you must come to me otherwise you will be recieving an independant cert, and this is made clear to all.
Rest assured i wil be looking further into this as i am not at all happy..
Beck
geeg
Judge Gigi-Honorary Geek
I am really sorry to hear this story. It seems that for many people bashing CND is the only way to try to sell themselves OR trying to say you are CND is the best way to sell their courses.
This is what happens when you deal with non professionals and dishonest people.
The good news is that CND have a brilliant trainer in Manchester called Julia Moran !!
As for the EZ Flow training center you mention and all the bad information coming form it .. I am actually shocked that this is happening .. and I'm sure John at Grafton would be genuinely disturbed to hear this tale. He is a very nice person and a professional and I know he would not like this going on at all. So I will be letting him know about it.
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loubylou
Well-Known Member
I have had an email today from a training centre (probably the one been spoke about in the previous post)
claiming to be introducing Ezflow into their training,
they have a training centre in Cardiff which i think is some where near wales (my geography is bad)
if you want me to forward the email to you, pm me your email addy and you can have it hun, hth
Ruth Mills
Well-Known Member
loubylou said:
LOL, Cardiff is the capital city of Wales :green:
Posted via Mobile Device
my geography is getting better now i am out on the road, but not ever as bad as my sister who when asked which way she would go to manchester, she said 'down' (we live in the midlands!!!!)
Anyhow, i train out of a salon in Cardiff, and the owner does some marketing to get the courses booked up, this is the only venue i teach out of in Cardiff...as such, this is the only way to get an Official EzFlow certificate.
Anyone feeling suspicious or looking for info on other academies 'claiming' to be EzFlow accredited, please feel free to pm me.
Its a shame it comes to this...
x
Anyhow, i train out of a salon in Cardiff, and the owner does some marketing to get the courses booked up, this is the only venue i teach out of in Cardiff...as such, this is the only way to get an Official EzFlow certificate.
Anyone feeling suspicious or looking for info on other academies 'claiming' to be EzFlow accredited, please feel free to pm me.
Its a shame it comes to this...
x
I would actively encourage anyone who is providing a service to clients to have adequate insurance to cover them. In the current climate there are too many people trying to make a fast buck against salons and therapists to take the risk.
I don't believe it is illegal to trade without insurance, just very unwise.
Mike
minky
Well-Known Member
Julia Moran
Well-Known Member
The good news is that CND have a brilliant trainer in Manchester called Julia Moran !!
Thank you Geeg "brilliant" gosh i hope i continue to live up to this!!!
I just have to tell you all this, how about this for a coincidence....... I had a lovely student last week for a 121 that had travelled quite a way to spend a few hours with me, whilst we were chatting afterwards she tells me that her day job is with trading standards and she has personnaly took at least 5 calls regarding complaints with people being mislead and misinformed over this so called training establishment in Manchester! Small world hey. She tells me that there is an act that this company are breaking and there are numerous cases going through the right channels to investigating further.
Thank you Geeg "brilliant" gosh i hope i continue to live up to this!!!
I just have to tell you all this, how about this for a coincidence....... I had a lovely student last week for a 121 that had travelled quite a way to spend a few hours with me, whilst we were chatting afterwards she tells me that her day job is with trading standards and she has personnaly took at least 5 calls regarding complaints with people being mislead and misinformed over this so called training establishment in Manchester! Small world hey. She tells me that there is an act that this company are breaking and there are numerous cases going through the right channels to investigating further.
kennedia
Well-Known Member
Now I don't think that's an awfully fair or professional comment to make!
Anyway, I think you'll find the training company you are referring to doesn't actually open in Cardiff until August - so probably not them then!
loubylou
Well-Known Member
I have not given any clue as to which training company it was, and i never said if it was open or not, nor am i going to,
so i don't see where i am been unprofessional,
the name has been kept private to the site but shared with the authorised ezflow trainer.
